Jeff
Ahh, there's nothing like a good Hargreaves thread to get the ol' juices flowing...:lala:
The "right decision" was the one that led to Owen getting to play in the World Cup before he's 75 years old...
The "right decision" was the one that led to Owen getting to play in the World Cup before he's 75 years old...
Ok...don't want to get into anything here but, calling someone an idiot doesn't bode well for your argument. If England is a country then so is Wales, so is Scotland, and so is Northern Ireland. But, these guys compete separatly in competitions like the World Cup but in the Olympics they compete as "Great Britain." An internationally recognized country would have a seat and its flag flying at the UN. England, Scotland, Wales, Northern Ireland do not, rather the Union Jack flies over the UN as Great Britain is the recognized country.
Perhaps you'd be willing to share your ENGLISH passport with us, then.
You just cannot understand the concept of dual citizenship, can you. Here we go, from the official Bayern Muenchen website:
Hargreaves has a British passport...
One must be a British citizen to hold the British passport.
For the purposes of talking about the world cup Englans is a seperate country. I was born there, I know for a fact how when it comes to soccer and many other things they don't like to be lumped together.
However we were talking about Hargreaves here.
http://www.footballculture.net/players/int_hargreaves.html
An Excerpt: "Despite never having lived in England, Hargreaves has elected to commit himself to playing for England, even though he is also eligible to play for Germany where he is nearing the five-year residential qualification period, Wales (his mother's birth-country) or Canada, where he was born and grew up."
See he may be eligible to play for those countries, but it still does not refute my point that he is a Canadian citizen. I was asked earlier in this thread to define "your country". I defined it as being the country you are a citizen of. For Hargreaves that is Canada.
However we were talking about Hargreaves here.
http://www.footballculture.net/players/int_hargreaves.html
An Excerpt: "Despite never having lived in England, Hargreaves has elected to commit himself to playing for England, even though he is also eligible to play for Germany where he is nearing the five-year residential qualification period, Wales (his mother's birth-country) or Canada, where he was born and grew up."
See he may be eligible to play for those countries, but it still does not refute my point that he is a Canadian citizen. I was asked earlier in this thread to define "your country". I defined it as being the country you are a citizen of. For Hargreaves that is Canada.
Kramer...you didn't say that in the other post. We all know that for the World Cup and other similar type sporting competitions, England is considered a separate country as is Scotland and Wales and Northern Ireland. But that is not what you said in your edited post. You said that England is a country..it isn't Great Britain is the country.
Hargreaves is a Canadian citizen. However, he's also a British citizen. He did not have to give up one to get the other. I have Canadian, British and Croatian citizenship and I have yet to receive an angry letter from either of these 3 countries over the other 2 citizenships.
As for why he couldn't have played for N.I. and Scotland, it's a complicated issue. If you were born outised of UK and have obtained British citizenship by virtue of residence or marriage, you're allowed to play for either of the 4 Home Countries. Some examples of this are John Barnes (England/Jamaica), Jim Whitley(Norn Iron/Zambia) and Robbie Earnshaw(Wales/Zambia).
If you have obtained a British passport through ancestry, you are restricted to playing for the Home Country the ancestor in question was born in. Examples of this are Terry Butcher(England/Singapore), John Robinson(Wales/Rhodesia) and Burton O'Brien(Scotland/South Africa).
Bear in mind this is not an actual rule. Neither players nor NTs are bound to this. However, the four home nations signed a gentleman's agreement in 1992 and have so far adhered to the points, more or less.
As for why he couldn't have played for N.I. and Scotland, it's a complicated issue. If you were born outised of UK and have obtained British citizenship by virtue of residence or marriage, you're allowed to play for either of the 4 Home Countries. Some examples of this are John Barnes (England/Jamaica), Jim Whitley(Norn Iron/Zambia) and Robbie Earnshaw(Wales/Zambia).
If you have obtained a British passport through ancestry, you are restricted to playing for the Home Country the ancestor in question was born in. Examples of this are Terry Butcher(England/Singapore), John Robinson(Wales/Rhodesia) and Burton O'Brien(Scotland/South Africa).
Bear in mind this is not an actual rule. Neither players nor NTs are bound to this. However, the four home nations signed a gentleman's agreement in 1992 and have so far adhered to the points, more or less.
Ok...what you had said in a post that you edited was that England is a country and your passport proves it or something in effect...read my reply to it (I don't feel like typing it again) and you will see I said something similar to what you are saying.
Hargraves dad was born in England thus making him eligable to play for England if he so chose.
Simple, easy, and no arguments here. Hargraves though when he travels to Japan and Korean for the WC will not have a passport that is English, rather his passport will say "Great Britain."
Hargraves dad was born in England thus making him eligable to play for England if he so chose.
Simple, easy, and no arguments here. Hargraves though when he travels to Japan and Korean for the WC will not have a passport that is English, rather his passport will say "Great Britain."
Well, Sven took 7 midfielders to the WC. 4 of the are injured at the moment, Beckham, Gerrard, Butt and Dyer.
Beckham is expected to recover, though whether or not he'll play the first game or two is still up in the air
Gerrard is only slightly injured and is expected to recover in time, but he has stamina problems and I'd be very surprised if he's able to play every game.
Butt may miss the WC altogether, Sven has already put a player on standby, as things do not look good for Nicky.
Dyer was a victim of a brutal tackle today and the extent of his injury is unknown, but everyone fears the worst.
So, yeah, Hargreaves chances of being in the first 11 and/or getting extended playing time look pretty good, especially considering that the 3 of the above players are playmakers.
Beckham is expected to recover, though whether or not he'll play the first game or two is still up in the air
Gerrard is only slightly injured and is expected to recover in time, but he has stamina problems and I'd be very surprised if he's able to play every game.
Butt may miss the WC altogether, Sven has already put a player on standby, as things do not look good for Nicky.
Dyer was a victim of a brutal tackle today and the extent of his injury is unknown, but everyone fears the worst.
So, yeah, Hargreaves chances of being in the first 11 and/or getting extended playing time look pretty good, especially considering that the 3 of the above players are playmakers.
Please don't put words in my mouth. I never said anything about my having an "english" passport and it proving anything. The only passport I have is Canadian and I wouldn't say anything otherwise.JureM said:
I am fully aware of how Hargreaves is eligible to play for England. Him choosing to do so howerver, and for whatever reasons, still means he turned his back on his country which is Canada.
Now you may want to argue the fact I called England a country (which it is to me-I'll be cheering on England because Canada isn't there, when someone asks me what country I was born in I say "England" not "Great Britain") rather than what we were talking about, but that seems pointless. Why not argue about my typos as well.
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