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i don't bout u
but it seems like we have all unconsciously become racists
the World Cup was suppose to be free of politics, discrimination and racism. And to unite all the people and all the nations of the world to play a sport that we all enjoy
Instead it has created chaos, everyone is pointing their fingers at someone, blamming someone for their teams lose, accusing refs for being bias, etc.........
Everyone says FIFA has corrupted the World Cup
But in fact we're the one's who has corrupted the World Cup
Its a shame that we have destoryed the
Spirit & Meaning of the World Cup
 

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After the 1966 World Cup, there was deep Latin Americans' bitterness toward Europeans. Sadly, history repeat itself. But this time, there was deep Europeans' bitterness toward Asian...:depress: I'm afraid there may be even a lot of European ultra right-wing politicians would get more votes...:depress:
 

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Alarich said:
blamming someone for their teams lose, accusing refs for being bias, etc.........
Everyone says FIFA has corrupted the World Cup
Doing any of the above does NOT make you a racist.
I have no idea where you get this idea. Somebody blames a ref for a missed offside call and you call him racist. It is really sad that you actually call people's rage against refs a form of racism. What would you call not allowing a black person into a golf resort then?(BTW still happens in the year 2002 :mad: )
 

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I wouldn't say it's racism, I think more of a case most of us blinded by rage and fury. Some refs in this WC make numerous bad/non calls and many these calls resulting their team out of the WC. So they blame rightly or wrongly on the ref, FIFA, the winner, host nation etc, etc. It's nothing new, 2 years ago, Portugal fans calling all sorts of name to the French and UEFA....I think we all seen it before.
 

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Racist is maybe a word that is too big. Still such a tournament our hidden nationalistic feelings come on the surface I guess. You support your team right or wrong (which actually is the same, for me even bigger, with your club team).

At the beginning of the tournament I talked with Bonita asking her what the WC meant to her. She described it in a way as modern day "peacefull" war. The players being the soldiers for their nation. Reading all the reactions here, it seems that once again our Bonita wasn't far from the truth :)
 

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Drawing a finite line between nationalism and jingoism is important to establish if it makes us rascist. I believe that becoming rascist involved actively and violently attacking (perhaps metaphorically) a person determined solely upon their race. Since supporting your country is not doing this, I don't think that I'm affected.

Sometimes it uncovers some rascist feelings, like the British hatred of Argentinians and Germans, but to be actively making us rascist is absurd. It has taken wars to forge the rift between Britain and Argentina and Germany, and football is not a factor in creating a rascist society.

In some instances, like El Salvador and Honduras, it has sparked conflict, but it has only ever been the trigger of such events, and not the cause. Maybe as the instigator of some rascist chanting in the pub, football can be blamed, but not so much as to make us go outside and beat up all the Brazilians in London.
 

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Bonita is right. Nationalism isn't needed in the same way as for say 100 years ago when it was used during war time to boost moral among soldiers and entire nations.

Nowadays when wars aren't that long lasting and frequent like 100 years ago, sports and specially football since it's so worldwide is were you get out the agression that our ancestors used in wars. Kinda explains the hooligans and the football-violence.

I think many of us hate the opponents/enemies just as much as we love our own team/nation.
I for one try to sublime my "hate-thoughts" to more "love" and cheering for my own team :)

Ain't I the wet dream for a mother-in-law? :dielaugh:

:nerd::sweeteye::nerd:
 

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Racism in Football

I think the truth is Racists follow football. Esp in Italian Football. Certain clubs like Lazio have an unpleasant reputation.
The world cup does bring out emotions, people get really attached to their team and when a decison goes against them they lash out. In this world cup there has been some awful decisions and I think the Spanish have been the harshest treated.
However I don't recall many Italian or Spanish complaints over the "hand of God incident" in '86, or the shameful and corrupt matchfixing between Peru and Argentina in '78. I dont recall too many Germans complain over the Outrageous foul commited by Harold Schumacher in '82. Very few English complain over the goal that wasn't in the final in '66. What about Rivaldo's acting during this campaign? I doubt any Brazilians attack this, there might be exceptions but I have't heard any. Oh of course Pele was fouled out of the '66 world cup by outrageous Portugues fouling. Every world cup there is incident, but it only becomes a big deal if it affects Italy ,Germany or Brazil.
 

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What I think is important to underline here when talking about nationalism is that all of us in this thread (I think) is talking out of a Western point of view. In Europe, nationalism is seen as something right wing and something not to be proud of. When travelling in Malaysia two years ago, I discovered that nationalism there is somewhat different. Malays are very proud of their country and in every bus and taxi I saw stickers saying "Proud to be Malaysian". Now that may have something to do with the fact that the country is a former British colony. (I hope I didn't offend and malays vecause that was not my intention) :) Maybe that is the case with other countries too?

Now, when talking about nationalism in football and especially a World Cup I think it is alright to be proud of your country's performances. If that is nationalism then it's fine with me. What I don't like, however, is when this nationalism or pride of your country takes over and controls your judgement and making you feel hate towarda another country. That is a danger and something that must never happen.

When looking at this World Cup, it strikes me that it has been one of the most peaceful ever. I haven't heard of one incident of hooliganism iin Japan or Korea, which of course is a very good thing.
 

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yet more....

I have to add I'm not criticising ITalian football,Lazio or decent football fans of that club, it's just they have a "reputation" which might of course be undeserved.
Ps in '82 Austria and Germany played out a match to exclude Algeria, now that is wrong.. Racist though? Probably not. Just typical WC weirdness. Remember in WC's host nations normanlly do well so I can't see people are suprised,I just think many countries and football teams underestimated S Korea.
 

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Re: Racism in Football

talkballs said:
I think the truth is Racists follow football. Esp in Italian Football. Certain clubs like Lazio have an unpleasant reputation.
The world cup does bring out emotions, people get really attached to their team and when a decison goes against them they lash out. In this world cup there has been some awful decisions and I think the Spanish have been the harshest treated.
However I don't recall many Italian or Spanish complaints over the "hand of God incident" in '86, or the shameful and corrupt matchfixing between Peru and Argentina in '78. I dont recall too many Germans complain over the Outrageous foul commited by Harold Schumacher in '82. Very few English complain over the goal that wasn't in the final in '66. What about Rivaldo's acting during this campaign? I doubt any Brazilians attack this, there might be exceptions but I have't heard any. Oh of course Pele was fouled out of the '66 world cup by outrageous Portugues fouling. Every world cup there is incident, but it only becomes a big deal if it affects Italy ,Germany or Brazil.
You are definitely English!!!!! :D :D :D
 

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Nationalism does not equal racism. Nor does jingoism for that matter. They can have negative impacts but they are distinct feelings.

The first post talked about the spirit of the world cup. Are you kidding me???
These aren´t the moronic olympic games where the most interesting thing is the overproduced opening ceremony.

The world cup, while bringing nations together, is about national pride. Just look at the first cup in Uruguay 1930 where after the final in which Uruguay beat Argentina. The Argentines across the River in Buenos Aires began attacking Uruguayans and sacked the Uruguayan counsulate. If anything there has been an improvement through the years.
 

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yes i do agree with you
many people calling egyptian refs sht
etc etc
asian country crap etc etc
but we're only human
ever read lord of the flies?
its in human nature to act like this
and it'll only continue
never stop
so its pretty useless to point out the facts of life
we're all racist, we're all voilent and we're all sinners.
 

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What is rasistic about calling an Egyptian referee sh!t and Japan a lame team if the person who made that comment really believes that referee is sh!t and that Japan is crap? Why do people have to assume that whenever a european makes a negative comment about a non-european it is racism? I believe Graham Poll is sh!t too, does this make me anti-anglosaxon?

Like if a player says "the english team is dirty and will get lots of goals" it is dare-talk but if he says "the cameroon team is dirty and will get lots of goals" he is labelled a racist. :rolleyes:

Some people really need to get over their complexes. Or at least learn what racism is before you launch attacks and brand someone a racist.
 

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Most of the Referees in this World Cup have sucked the BIG WEENIE !!!

This is not, & I repeat...this is not a racist statement !!!!

And they come from all corners of the World !!

:cap:
 

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Cracker said:
I think many of us hate the opponents/enemies just as much as we love our own team/nation.
I for one try to sublime my "hate-thoughts" to more "love" and cheering for my own team :)
Well said Cracker :)!

I also try to concentrate on my own team more than I do with the opponent. If I didn't then why support my team. Supporting ones team is one of the great things in football :proud:;).

About the us being racist. Well this isn't about being racist! It's more, like many of you've said, about feeling nationalistic and close to your NT/club. I'm definitely not a racist anyway ;).
 

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Patriotic pride is nothing but our inescapable primitive territorial mammal instincts at work. Our necessity to group was, and still is, essential for our survival. Our social structure may have become more complex through cooperative evolution than that of the other mammals, but it is still fundamentally basic in principal: a quest for superiority and protection.

No matter how much our arrogant and human-centric views of our selves makes us try to disassociate from the rest of the animal kingdom, or how complex and civilized we think we are, we're still simply a mammal.
 

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Pila said:
Patriotic pride is nothing but our inescapable primitive territorial mammal instincts at work. Our necessity to group was, and still is, essential for our survival. Our social structure may have become more complex through cooperative evolution than that of the other mammals, but it is still fundamentally basic in principal: a quest for superiority and protection.

No matter how much our arrogant and human-centric views of our selves makes us try to disassociate from the rest of the animal kingdom, or how complex and civilized we think we are, we're still simply a mammal.
Are you studying Anthroplogy?;)
I said it before and I'll say it again those who think that calling refs names is a form of racism more than likely haven't suffered the 'real' form of racism. Like being banned from certain activities because of the color of you skin.....
 

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My studying days were over a decade ago.
 

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And according to our files, "Professor" Pila, there's an outstanding Incomplete from semester 5 of "Skirt : When Pull comes to Push."
 
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