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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
I would like to know if you think we'll qualify for Euro 2004. I think if the younger players play like they did against Lithuania along with some extras then we have got a good chance. The team I think has to be built around the best players like Stankovic and Kezman. The older players need to retire from international football and if they still want to be part of the set up they should help with coaching or something. If there was to be older players it should be ones that haven't got huge egos like Jugovic.
what are your views and do you agree with mine.
 

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We have to quolify:D

I agree that the future leaders of the team should be Deki & Kezman. These guys currently are in the good momentum & should transfer their "mmod" onto the other players.

The main problem with our team is moral, which is at it's record low:( They have to pull up their socks & start playing football.

They can, ony if they want to:)
 

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we must qualify.

deki stankovic and kezman will be our new leaders. they're still very young and their talent enhances each year.
we repeat each time that only time will make our NT grow.
if we have a good coach we can rely on and let work in peace whatever the results are then we'll have a good team. yes a good "team".
until recent times, in yugoslavia the coach was calling up all the stars and making the squad . whatever the tactics employed, he wouldn't be criticized.
now football is different and we've learnt since a 6-1 defeat against holland that we couldn't do that anymore, : selecting - almost at random - 11 players, putting them on the pitch and waiting for an individual sparkle to win the game...we've learnt, and i really hope we did, that football belongs to teams and not to individuals.
 

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Remember Quali for 1990

Do you remember those days ? We had not qualified for Mexico and were only 4th in our group behind France, Bulgaria and GDR by losing all three matches abroad. Then we failed to qualify for EC 88 by losing 1-4 in the decissive match in Beograd against England. My god, that generation was really crap.

This one is different. We must be honest, we missed this WC because of 3 bad matches under Djokic in 2000. After that, we didn`t shine, but we played solid and the results were good. If Slovenia hadn`t won luckily, narrowly in Switzerland and against Russia at home, we would have gone 2nd. and don`t forget the big gap to Swiss, that also shows our quality. We aren`t that bad.

After 88 there was qualification for Italy and no-one expected nothing against France and Scotland but we threw out the 3rd placed team of Mexico because we had relied on both, experience (Susic, Vujovic) rising stars (Stojkovic) and young prospects (Prosnecki, Savicevic). That was the clue.

You see it can go faster up then we might think. Look at Poland or rejuvenated Ireland. We should concentrate on WC 2006 but taking any chance to qualify for Portugal 2004 with -

a good mixture

Don`t be always so pessimistic.
 

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Discussion Starter · #6 ·
I realise that but this generation of players coming through are not as good as the last one, and possibly we will have to wait a long, long time to have a group of players like the one's in the 90's. It's just a shame the sanctions were put on us, and that was only because we were favourites and were really strong. We would have won in 92 and did well in USA 94 and Euro 96. These players are good but we get beat by an understrength Ukraine team. I think that some more of the players need to go abroad. I also heard somewhere that if anyone wants to buy Kezman, it will cost them £19 million. Players like Ivic and Ilic have got to move abroad and players like Mihajlovic have got to be a good influence to the younger players and not get sent off everygame. The future though lies with Stankovic and Kezman.
 

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Ok..the problem that Yugoslavia (soon to be Serbia and Montenegro) has is the same problem we have in Croatia and that is that there is a large gap between the "Old guys" and the "young guys." There is not bridge of good talented say 27 or 28 years olds that form a perfect bridge to the older generation of players. We have that same problem and it showed in the Mexico game early this morning (NY time). So, both our countries have to face up to the "growing pains," and I guess we have to get used to some losing for the next few years.

But, there is good talent where the future will be fine.

Here's the other problem. The players rather than either stay in the domestic league, or go to a lesser team in say Serie A or the EPL, these guys go to teams where yes, they will get paid well, but, they also ride the bench and are not regulars in the line up. This hurts the players development, especially in this day and age where the big clubs like a Manchester United buy these young 21 and under guys who have the talent, but their development is retarded by the fact that they get no playing time what so ever except with the reserve team (if they are lucky). I know players have to look out for themselves, especially as they get older, but sometimes they have to sacrifice some pay in order to get playing time to develope their games in live game situations and then they will get paid the big bucks down the line.

Somehow, this comes down to one thing....and I think it was mentioned before, let the players stay in their own domestic league and grow with their clubs..and have some kind of transfer rule where the kid can only leave after he is 23 or so to the big clubs in Europe.

To show an example, Mexico. Pretty much that who team plays in the Mexican league. It is not that great of a leauge, but the players get to play 5 out of every 6 games, they play 90 minutes, get in form and in shape...this helps a great deal. They pay is not great but they get paid much more than the regular people and can retire comfortably.
 

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The reason Leo Beenhakker gave about Mexicans staying in their own league is that the pay there is great... ;)

Our countries may not have 25 year olds wtih the talent we used to have but do you get why that seems to be a problem for the coaches?:confused: I don't! We lose with the oldies and the play is horrible to watch, and I cannot imagine it can get any worse with the youngsters and I bet it would be better. And putting the oldies in also makes other people laugh at you :rolleyes:
 

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Jure is right on the dott;):)

The gap exist because when that generation was supposed to play football, we played some other games...nasty ones. (and mind someone dare turn this into political issue;). This is a fact that affected football in both Croatia & Yugoslavia.) So we are stuck with generation of oldies (Suker, Prosinecki, Mijat, Miha and so on...) and bunch of youngsters with potential, but just not there yet.

And, Monti, in yu Coach of the NT is the "generacija" with our oldies. Thats why Mijat can leave the team & go for the Real Madrid CL victory celebrations, rather than play the game with the team, and get away with it.

Oldies are not leading by example, and we need a coach that will put some discipline int the team.

(Bora milutinovic somehow comes to mind;):D)
 

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Discussion Starter · #10 ·
The Yugoslav FA need to persuade Bora to take over the national team. He has done it in countries where the talent is not as good as it is in Yugo. Savicevic has done an ok job but I think a manager with experience is needed. Experience is needed within a squad, which is why players like Milosevic, Djordevic, Mirkovic and Djorovic need to be in the team. However I think that we are in a slightly better situation than Croatia as we have less players over 30 in our squad and hopefully we can get rid of those players soon.
 

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Number of "old" players in the team is irrelevant;)

The question is if the coach has guts to brak away with them, as number one.

and number two, is chose from the oldies the ones that youngsters can learn something from. Not for their past glory, but right now, on the field.

There are always as many youngsters as any coach might need in any country. The question is if the coach knows who they are & secondly if he's ready to give them a chance.
 

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Aca, the old ones also played under Boskov and he wasn't a part of their generation I believe, althoug, he's 75 right? so it might be possible :howler:

Or maybe I didn't understand you quote very well "(And, Monti, in yu Coach of the NT is the "generacija" with our oldies)."
 

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I think we can qualify. Yes, we are going through a crisis, yes, we have senile old men in our team, but hopefully something will improve by October this year.
I am looking at the teams in this WC, and apart from Argentina, Italy, Cameroon and a few others, none have really impressed, which makes me a bigger optimist.
One thing I would like to point out though is, forget about Bora and the rest, Dejo is staying for a loooong time, so drop the wishful thinking.
 

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Discussion Starter · #14 ·
Well he should call up Jugovic and Drulovic, maybe Jokanovic but not Mijat and Miha. Sure Mijat was the best player in Spain in the mid 94 - 98 but now he is way past his prime as is Miha. We need players that have not got huge egos. I think we will qualify anyhow, probably in 2nd place behind Italy and face someone in the play offs. What do you guys think the team should be up front. Mine would be;

GK Jevric
CB Mirkovic
CB Stefanovic
CB Djorovic
RWB Lazetic
LWB J. Stankovic
CM D. Stankovic
CM Ilic
CM Ivic
CF Milosevic
CF Kezman

That would be it for now, i think it is a good blend of youth and experience without any major egos. Jugovic and Drulovic would be bench players for me to do a job if needed.
 

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a quicky!!!!

i would play 4-4-2

jevric

mirkovic saveljic stefanovic and duljaj

lazetic stankovic djordjevic and ilic

kezman and milosevic


i put saveljic in because i know he knows Bata very well so it will be a good couple. I'm not very sure about WHERE to put them, meaning left/right, but they seem the best players to me.

ps
get rambo as a sub, for laza, or vice versa
LAKU NOC ;)
 

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For 4 - 4- 2 you need fast and capable central defenders, ours are not bad but I wouldn't classify them as fast.

Anyway, I vote for 3-5-2 with the following players.
NOTE: the inclusion of Mijat and Jokan is done only because I know we have no other choice, it will happen whether we like it or not.
And I guess thepretenders defence of older players and using France as an example doesn't work anymore...:D :tongue:


__________________Jevric

_________Mirkovic___Bunjevcevic_____Djorovic


________________Jokanovic (Duljaj)

Lazetic____Stankovic_____Mijatovic (Ilic)__Djordjevic


____________Kezman________Milosevic (Kovacevic)


If Bunja doesn't recover from injury, replace him with Djora and put Krstajic on the left.
Of course we have other good options as well, such as Dzodic, Obradovic, Gavrancic, Stefanovic, Lalatovic etc.


Naprijed plavi!!! :)
 

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Duljaj's place, isn't that all the way in the back :confused: RSF just make a line up according to your wishes, not to 'what will happen' that takes the fun away :) I wouldn't leave Stefanovic out but Djorovic,. I find that guy so, well, nothing actually (boring and not that great) :D The other defenders you named, in the sentence with Stefanovic, are pretty unknown to me so I cant comment.

the 'odbrana' really is the thing we have to focus on because i think everyone more or less agrees on the other spots. I dont know if defenders have to be fast, look at Jan Heintze or Frank de Boer, or Hierro for that matter. they need to be insightful, read the game, I think Deki/Bata/Duljaj can do that.. the 4th defender is my worry, Saveljic just isn't thatttt good, so maybe Bunjevcevic..? Haven't heard that much about him as about Duljaj.


What do you guys think of Pjanovic? Could he be a future NT regular?

For some reason I find 4 4 2 a nicer structure on the pitch :)
 

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Discussion Starter · #18 ·
For the WC qualifiers our problem was we could not score goals, we dominated posession and made chances but we could not score. The defence has looked good in the matches I have seen.
Well i gotta go and sadly endure more English hype because they beat Argentina, now they think that they'll win the tournament, hopefull they'll face France if they go through.
It really annoys me that we're not in Korea and Japan. What I have seen we're better than a lot of teams that qualified.How Slovenia qualified I don't know. Well better luck next time.
 

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Yeah, Slovenia is a disgrace, it is really shameful we let them kick us out.

Montenegrina, a 4-4-2 formation is one of the reasons we got thumped 6-1 against Holland.
With a 4-4-2 you have basically only 2 central defenders, with a 3-5-2 you have 3, so the math is very simple. :)

Our defence is not as bad as in EURO2000, however it is far from solid, we conceed at least a goal in every game, which is still not a very good record.
 

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Discussion Starter · #20 ·
I just watched Italy and Croatia and I think Italy's weakness is when they come up against pace. Dejo must have had someone there checking them out. Anyway if we play quick passing football against the italians I think we could beat them.
 
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