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Discussion Starter #1
My fears about the WC ref'ing are being borne out. Aside from the France-Senegal game (I agree with your analysis, Kerry), the ref'ing has met my low expectations. Yellow cards handed out for the same offenses that going the other way didn't even merit stoppage of play. German players were getting hacked with impunity after the game was out of hand. The first goal disallowed? Gee. The Irish get those CHEAP yellows? That will come back to haunt them.

I think our guys have to go out there with the attitude that there are no refs. We are going to get tomahawked with no protection from the whistle-blowers.

What do you guys think?

Oldplayer
 

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That is why I hate tha accumulating yellow card rule. Each ref interprets differently what a yellow car offence is. It's funny, I was watching the Ireland-Camaroon game and I was telling my dad that this ref seems fair and that he was not going to give out yellow cards just for the sake of giving out yellow cards. The one example was when the Irish guy pushed the Cameroon defender in the back with both hands, the ref called a foul but did not issue a yellow. Then all of a sudden he gave out two cheap yellows to Ireland for infractions that did not even come close to the push I mentioned....
 

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Speaking of bad reffing....did you see the Spain-Slovenia game??? To not call two penalties for Slovenia which were obvious (and I'm not going to get into that yellow card on what should have been that first penalty) and then to call one for Spain in the closing minutes when not 2 minutes before a Spanish player takes out a Slovene player in the box without even trying to make an attempt to play the ball is just horrible...Slovenia deserved a much better fate....
 

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Warning: If you've taped the Brazil-Turkey match, you may want to read this after the match.





I just saw my first instance of dubious officiating during the second half of the Brazil-Turkey match (I missed the first half).

My biggest gripe is that on free kicks, Brazil repeatedly rushed the kicker before the ball was touched. At least three times a Brazilian player broke the ten-yard barrier and was nearly to the ball before the Turkish player kicked it.

Turkey complained and the ref warned Brazil but let play go on after Brazil rushed each kick. This was especially bad on the last play of the match when Turkey had a free kick in the center of the field 20 yards from Brazil's goal.

He also allowed both teams to do too much diving.

The red card for the Turkish player at the end of the match was unnecessary, especially since Rivaldo completely faked the effect of being hit by the ball.
 

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Discussion Starter #5
This is exactly what I've come to expect. The underdogs will get no breaks in the normal course of play. The Slovenia game was a joke! The first red against Turkey was justified, but the Brazilian player stayed on his feet all the way to the box just so he could take his dive there! A horrible P.K. to award. The red card and the man advantage IS the penalty.

Rivaldo is a big Baby and grabbed his face the instant the ball hit him in the legs! I hope some of the big boys give him something to really cry about in later games! The Turks played a great game, asking no quarter.

How about the Croatian game? The P.K. may have been the right call but other than that, I hated the ref'ing. Again, a field day of cards against Croatia fo no real reason. That idiot Tommy Smythe claimed the Mexican coaching was "an incredible job." Mexico played "superbly." UGGGGH!:yuck: :yuck: :yuck:

I am afraid teh ref'ing against the U.S. will be such that Mathis may have to have another national T.V. bleeping bloope. Quote: "I get f....ing kicked in the fact and I get the f.....ing red card."

Oldplayer
 

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Well Portugal does not have the same love affair with FIFA that Brazil has;) , but if one of the two teams will get screwed over by officiating, I am sure it will be our side.
 

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Discussion Starter #7
One week into the Tournament, and the role of the Ref's is as important as I feared.

Despite what Ero may believe, the Azzuri lost today largely because of the TWO GOALS that were unbelievably called bacK. Nice game overall and reasonably ref'd EXCEPT for the two most important decisions! (and I was pulling for Croatia!)

I just hope our next two ref's don't play as big a role in the outcome of our games. (That's why it's always nice to have about a 4-0 lead. 4-0 lead with about 6 minutes left, that's when I start to relax.)(But still clock-watch like crazy!)

The politics of ref assignments is interesting, isn't it?

I'M SOOOO HAPPY!!!!! 3-2!

Oldplayer
 

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Well....I think that the first goal that was disallowed was not offsides, but the linesman saw it another way...the second goal that they disallowed, I think was a foul. The Italian player had a a handful of Simic's shirt, and pulled him down, though I don't think it was intentional but never the less was a foul.

Anyway, what this game came down to was some great saves by both goalies, the fact that Italy let the game slip out of their hands, and the goalies best friend....(The post)....:D
 

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Sorry Jure, I think I'll disagree with you here a bit. ;)

The referee and the linesman of today's Italy-Croatia game should be thrown to the crocodiles. These people are dangerous. They were just too clueless to be real. I'm familiar with Graham Poll and his officiating from the European competitions games and he is the most coward ref I know. Meaning, he is mostly afraid to not make a wrong decision and he ends up being to reluctant to call or not call something with no consistency. That Danish linesman was something else though. At the first cancelled goal by Vieri, not only Vieri himself wasn't offside, but he was even behind the ball. When you see that and you flag, you just dont know the rules. Clueless.

As for the second goal, I dont understand how can he call a foul against the italian when Simic was pulling Inzaghi's shirt just the same. Come on, if the shirt pulls were called fouls then no corner or free kick in a crowded area would go through without a foul being called. These things happen 50 times per game and it is never a foul. The ref and the linesman just didnt want Italy to equalise is only explanation I have.

Till yesterday I was pretty much sure that no european referee was bad enough to **** up on such a game. I was also quite harsh on referees from Asia and Africa who usually have their fair share of cluelesness. But these dudes today proved me wrong. Unbelievable. And mind you, Poll isnt even the worse European referee... wait to see Gilles Vesseiles and Hough Dallas. :(
 

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Amo...

It wasn't Vieri they called offsides, it was the player (I forgot who) that jumped and got the ball with his foot in mid air that they called offsides. It was very questionable....

You see the Inzaghi play one way, I see it another. Shirt pulling happens alll the time, but when seen it is called...this just so happend that Simic was pulled down by Inzaghi (sorry for the spelling), Simic fell as a result, I think it had to be called.

The bottom line is that Italy had a lead, and they let it slip. The blame is on themselves first and foremost....and then that unlucky post off the free kick....that was like the only place on the inside of the post that ball could have hit to make it go out like that....about a centimeter more to the inside, its a sure goal...but that is football...as we say in Croatia, "Lopta je okrugla.." or "the ball is round."
 

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Fair enough. Each on his own I suppose.

as we say in Croatia, "Lopta je okrugla.." or "the ball is round."
Heh, this reminds of the great Ivica Osim. I'm sure you're familiar with that football master who's love for the drink ( :drunk: ) prevented him from going down as one of the best coaches ever. Anyway, during his spell here in Greece with Panathinaikos, his intellectual and analytical post game comment after a game with bad lack for his team wrote history. The great Ivica walks in the press conference room with an angry look, sits on the chair in front of the journalists and starts his speach with the following words: "The ball is a f*cking whore...".

Priceless. Grande Osim! :D
 

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Both calls that disallowed goals were made by the Assistant Ref. I think he got caught ball watching on the offside. That's when the play is so intense, or he was screened by so many players that he was looking for the ball. When it appeared above the crowd, he then looked at the 2nd to last defender. Sure enough, a man is offside.:eekani: :jester: :ass: :wallbang: :doh: :embarass: :embarass: :embarass:

The shirt pulling foul kept the defender from having a fair chance at the ball. The AR popped his flag on that one, resulting in the ref blowing the whistle.

All refs are evaluated each game. This guy is done. He's headed home by now.

que sera sera
 

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Discussion Starter #14
I hate shirt-pulling. Mainly it's an annoyance as a player. But once in a while, it really hinders you. If you get caught freeing yourself with an elbow to the face, chest, groin, you will get booked. That is why it should be called EVERY time it is seen. If all the fouls slowed down the game during the transition period required to get used to it, so be it. The game would be better off without it. What's the one knock on the sport? not enough scoring! get rid of the holding and free up the offensive players!

Oldplayer
 

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Oldplayer, you have played football. Think this: In a corner situation when most of the players gather in the area, just as the taker kicks the ball in the air and the movement in the area starts, is there a SINGLE defender who doesnt pull his opponents shirt or hold him back or a single attacker who doesn't push and pull in order to get to the ball? Take any picture with a goal from a corner and see around, most players have their hands busy. Attackers and defenders alike.

These things can't be called fouls. Not in a million years. There are defenders like Nesta and Rio Ferdinand who have made shirt pulling an "art". If you play competitive football (not nessasarily proffesional), the third defencive thing you learn after tackling and heading is how to get your opponent out of his way without doing it blatantly enough for the ref to call a foul. World class defenders excell to that. See how Fabio Cannavaro uses his ass to put other players off the ball or how Paolo Montero flies his elbows to people's chests (every once in a while he hits them in the face and gets a red card) or how Fernando Hierro pushes with his arm.

As long as it is not blatant, such tricks are not only allowed, but football coaches encourage them and teach them. Its really romantic to think they should stop existing.
 

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AMOROSO! said:
Paolo Montero flies his elbows to people's chests (every once in a while he hits them in the face and gets a red card)


Best statement i have seen today

i love amo's posts ;) :D

Lav
 

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excerpt from trap interview
-----------------------------
Trapattoni on the defensive as critics sharpen knives
SENDAI, Japan, June 9 (AFP)
"In Italy we say the ball is round. Yesterday we had a series of negative incidents - some we were not to blame for but some were self-inflicted," said Trapattoni who agreed a two-year extension to his contract."
-----------------------

Guess he borrowed a line from us


Lav
 

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Discussion Starter #18
Amo,

It is not romantic nor naive to expect the laws of football to be enforced. We have calls of offside made when maybe a player is a millimeter offsides, but then ignore shirt pulling? (Or infamously handing the ball into the goal?)

Of course defenders pull and strikers push. But the ref's and linesman should call what they see. Everyplayer has his own way of dealing with offenders. It would just make for a better game if the laws were enforced. IMHO, American basketball has been ruined by lax enforcement of long established rules. I don't want to see the same happen in football.

BTW, compare the lopsided number of yellow cards given to Mexico and Ecuador in this morning's game. Did anyone watch it? I missed it but saw a very good Costa Rica Turkey game.

Oldplayer
 

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The 1st week was excelent, but they are getting progressively worst as time goes by.

The Ref and One Assistant for the Mexico v. Ecuador was the worst thus far, as was the Ref for Uruguay v. France.
 

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Discussion Starter #20
Well, I'm SO surprised that the ref tonight sucked big time. The most ignorant penalty kick awarded in these games and it is at a time to allow Korea to get back in the game before half-time. SOOPRIIZE SOOPRIZE SOOPRIZE

And then that call comes back to haunt us as Goose has to be every so gentle around their players on the tying cross and subsequent hed ball. WHICH in and of itself was a pure BS call against Donovan for contnact after he clears the ball. But was their a penalty called against the Koreans when they knocked DMB down from behind IN THE BOX on a through ball that he was clearly going to control before the endline? Hell, NO!

McBride . . . the Koreans tackled him, cleated him, climbed him, and cheap shotted him all night long. In the final five minutes when it was far to late to set any kind of tone, Herr Mier called at least two to three of these hacks. However, this crap had been going on THE ENTIRE GAME. If these hacks were fouls in the last five minutes, they were certainly fouls the rest of the game. But Herr Mier refused to call them earlier.

I am not happy with this ref stuff. But, it's something that was forseeable. If you had a real team leader as captain, he would have worked on the ref to take care of the situation before retaliation ensued. Oh, I forgot, Claudio is the "Captain."

Sorry this thread is so "right on" regarding the refs. I wish it wasn't so.

Oldplayer
 
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