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Discussion Starter #1
the other day i was thinking about how we won the scudetto and how good it felt to be the best again. however i suddenly realised that maybe winning the scudetto wasn't exactely in the best interest for our future.

Four weeks before the season ended, juve looked like finishing 2nd or third again. We had enough and players like Mutu, Doni were said to be juve players next season. They were basically done deals and it was looking like that Juve were finally going to fix the problems which we have had for the past few seasons. A left sided player, a top young forward who could play upfront, behind the strikers and so on.

We were looking at rebuilding our team and buying quality players. BUT, as soon as we won the scudetto, it was as if Moggi had turned 180 degrees and believed that we didnt need these player anymore.

I'm not saying that we didn't deserve the scudetto, but IMO that we were very very very lucky to win it. We didnt dominate as a team. We won by luck in the end and it doesnt take a genious to realise that if juve are to succeed in the CL and in Serie A again next season, we must buy players to fix our problems.

Winning this scudetto has basically made Moggi believe that we dont need any players. This is absolute bull****!!!

I know that we might land up with Doni, and maybe even Cannavaro or Nesta. But what makes me angry is how Moggi plays down everything.

IMO we need a left back, a left midfielder, and least another good striker.

not to mention the fact that if we lose Thuram, we have to replace him, and no Fresi isnt a replacement, he is a back up or a coppa italia player.

Davids is almost certain to leave, who will replace him?? Brighi???? sure, young and talented, but has no experience at all. Tacchinardi is not good enough to play teh role of Davids. Baiocco??? same as brighi!

What if Salas, DP or TRez get injured??? who have we got back ups?? when playing in the CL, you need at least 4 to 5 good strikers. Sure we have 3 and Zalayeta is young and looks like he could be good, but if DP or Trez get injured, we are in trouble again like last season.

Players like Placente, Coco and Chivu have all been rumoured to leave their clubs. and they all will leave and Moggi does nothing to buy them. Sure, Placente has been rumoured to join us, but we should have put the bid in and secured him. We need him!!

i know i'm being over drastic here, but if we dont start securing players like Doni and Placente, other teams will buy them first. And juve gets the left overs like every other season.

i can see us next season without a left back, and with no left midfielder or attacking midfielder.

Why is Moggi not signing Doni or Placente yet???

what are your thoughts??

i know i'm being a drama queen etc.....and its still early stages in the transfer campaign, but can anyone seriously see juve buy these rumoured players?
 

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One word "NO" & "NO".

:dontcare:

Ciao
 

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How can winning the scudetto be "bad" in any possible way? Being the best team in the country is the objective of any club per se, so winning the scudetto can't possibly be bad even in an exaggerated way. Having the best team on paper means nada if you don't win, Juventus won, so what's your problem?

And saying Juventus did not deserve to win the scudetto is something only bitter Inter and Roma fans might say. You had the best defence and the best attack, that says it all. You did not win BECAUSE of luck, you won DESPITE the average/bad seasons of many of your midfielders and the lack of cover up front. Your defence+goalkeeper and the tridenete of Nedved- Del Piero - Trezeguet had a scudetto-winning season and won it for you.

I can't say I really understand what you mean and want. But thats just me I suppose.
 

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Amo, what CUG meant is pretty obvious, really! ;)

Had Juve not won the Scudetto (or better said: had Inter not falter) the team's shortcomings would have already been handled by now, well kind at least. Some weeks ago, when Juve was trailing behind Inter and Roma, the only positive aspect was that Moggi couldn't deny our (obvious) weaknesses or silence it with the adage: "We're always right when we win". We won the championship, sure, and I'm the happiest man on Earth. But in the same conditions, perhaps next time, the rivals will be more up to the task and the share of luck that worked for us perhaps will against us. Roma has the best roster, with more regularity, they would have eaten us alive. Who knows? That's a risk I'm not willing to take next season. Isn't the purpose to be better than the opponents? You gotta afford yourself thge means of your ambition.

We didn't win it because of an extreme luck, that's part of the game. But where are we heading to if we start blinding ourselves and if we erase all the issues that had us worried during the whole season. We cannot take anything for granted and this unexpected (though delightful) outcome is more a bonus on which we should keep on working, than an accomplishment. Some weeks ago, it seemed that we were set to make huge changes, investissements, giving us the means to be really succesfull again, on a long-dated perspective intended. And then, we win the Scudetto and,... all those justified feelings (should) vanish!?

C'mon! I reckon you always tend to let yourself filled up with self-satisfaction when you're on the winning side, and that will play dirty tricks on Juve! It's not about being perfectible (every single team is, in almost every department), which is ungrateful to someone who did so much for Juve. But we can't make omelets without breaking eggs! (French saying :D) I'm sorry but Moggi's policy here is more about pottering about than fixing problems for good. The conjoncture is not the best right now money-wise (according to many things I read, on which I won't wander) but isn't it what savings are for? We spent big last summer and being reluctant on big signings this summer is perfectly comprehensible. But that's how the world works today! Last year the management opened the Pandora Box by giving up on the old reasounable transfers policy. The shortcomings have been detected and they're soi obvious I won't even sum them up. Now he's gotta do everything it takes to get us the best players.

Ciao.
 

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It's Juve's objective to win the CL. Therefore you need a very good team and luck. I mean, you can be the best team in Europe but if you have a bad moment or a lot of injuries in the last stages of the CL you're screwed. So Juve has also to compete for a CL-spot in Serie A. So you a great squad with depth. I think Moggi is aware of that.

Last year Juve did big spending for a new Juve. I think this was a one-time operation. Moggi will buy talented players who are no superstars and Doni will be one of them.
 

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We deserve the scudetto

I can not belive you, CUG, above all .. how can you lost your faith?:(

You who I reckon speaks loudly against that Juve hater.. :confused:

Moggi is wrong.. damn wrong if he thinks we don't need players like Mutu or Doni.. we need new talent players and build up some more to help re-generation in Juve.

Hey CUG, ;) .. Be the champion felt good
 

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Man u juventines are perrinial whimers. What more do u want? you won the scudetto. U have the best defence and the best attack. In short u deserved it. There will be the usual transfers as usual. no need for u to turn the team inside out. :confused:

though i agree with CUG that u need a player like Chivu or Placente for the Left side. ;)

Hope u ppl Perform well in the UCL next year (this goes for all the teams that will be playing the UCL from Serie A). The prestige of Serie A is at stake.:eek:

Ciao
 
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Well i certainly don't regret winning the Scudetto. We were in line for some good luck especially after the last 2 seasons. Of course i do note the fact that if it weren't for Inter faultering, we would have had yet another year without any major silverware. I'm sure the people on the board noticed that as well.

I understand that supporters want to have all the best players in their team but that is not possible. We have to be realistic. After last year's transfer market fiasco (which it was) it left us with a team that needed months to get in gear. Buffon was making all kinds of mistakes, Nedved's form was in tatters and the team as a whole looked very unbalanced. Thankfully, the team managed to get their act together but not in time to save yet another underachieving CL campaign.
The last thing we need is a complete overhaul of the team, and i'm glad to see most Juve fans here are not advocating this.

The key is not to judge our team on its Serie A performaces, it's to judge them in the CL ones. Which were dismal to say the least. I agree Moggi should make a few selected purchases but his priorities are not only to make sure the club is successful, but also that the balance books stay out of the red. And he is not someone to put financial concerns above anything.

I think ultimately, Moggi will improve the squad with a few selected and well measured purchases, and i'm wqually sure we won't get all the players we want on our wish-lists. We should be content with what is done.

Although knowing you lot, you'll never be satisfied. :)
 

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Nero said:
The key is not to judge our team on its Serie A performaces, it's to judge them in the CL ones.
But this is Italy Nero. ;)

For Serie A teams nothing matters more than Serie A. The CL is a bonus for Italian teams. Especially if we consider that NO team will manage to do good in both Serie A and CL. Serie A might not be the most beatifull or best league but its surely the most difficult one (Copyright Glen, all rights reserved ;)). Considering that even in the English and Spanish leagues in recent years teams that did really good in the Champions League ended up with egg on their face in domestic competitions. Valencia of 99-00 and 00-01 come to mind, as well as Leeds two years ago and Real Madrid this season. CL is not anymore that one game every other week mostly again the Champions of Czech Republic or Sweden with big countries teams wrestling on later stages...

In Italy, when a team like Juventus does not win Seria A and ends up 4th, even winning the Champions League could mean sacking of the coach, pressure by the supporters and ousting of several players. In Serie A, winning Seria A is the BIG target and this is what the team is judged on.

Moreover, I think the general feeling here is to underestimate last season's Juventus. Buffon and Nedved showed their realselfs in the two later thirds of the championship, Trezeguet and Del Piero were absolutely bombastic and the defence was rock solid. Even Thuram, despite his constant moaning and whining had a very decent season as a right back. Consider that you had your fair share of injury problems (Montero and Tudor played like, 15 games each, even less? And Salas...) I just don't understand what more you could expect. Sure, there was a lack of cover up front but thats mainly because Salas got injured.

Plus, while Juventus midfield was more or less dissapointing this season it was far from bad. Nedved was best player of Serie A for quite a while, Davids was if not his usual good self in a very decent form towards the end of the season. Conte was surprisingly good. The dissapoitment mainly came from the likes of Zambrotta and Tacchinardi, but come on, these guys did not turn into bad players overnight.

Juve needs cover. And this is what Moggi is working on. You got Miccoli for the attack who is really good and along with Zalayeta and Salas will form a great back up strike force. Fresi was probably among the best Serie A defenders this season. Brighi and Baiocco also come from decent seasons. Plus, you'll be getting either Nesta or Cannavaro and probably one more midfielder and a left back due to Pessotto's injury. Thats ALL you need.

Why fix it when it ain't broken? And if you call a scudetto winning Juve broken, then well, my friends, you are wrong... :)
 
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I totally agree with you Amo that Serie A and the Scudetto is an Italian team's main objective. But i also think that a good run in the CL should be a major target next year for all the teams invovled, especially for Juve since they've won the domestic title this year. I think talk of being a contender is premature to say the least but i do think it's important that (hopefully) all 4 Italian teams have a good showing in the CL. Most of all to silence the nay-sayers and critics who say Italian teams have lost the plot in European competition. It's a matter of prestige and i think you'll agree with me that Italian teams have underachieved immensely in the tournament. If we as fans of Serie A want to claim our league is the best then our teams have to perform to a certain degree in Europe to back that up.
Juve have been quite unluck over the past few season because we're usually struggling form-wise by the time CL group stages are in full flow, due to one crisis or another. It's almost perennial the way players seem to dip in form at the beginning and gradually get into gear only for it to be too late to save our season in Europe. It's imperative to perform well in Serie A but it's time Italian teams started playing well in the CL and in the UEFA Cup.

Having said that i totally agree with your stance that a team shouldn't devote all its efforts into the CL for the simple reason one game or one unlucky break can mean failure. It's almost as much due to luck as it is due to quality that teams win the competition. Where as in a proper league the most consistent team overall wins, which is not always the case in the Champions' League. And off course because Serie A is such a difficult league it's harder for Italian teams to balance between performing well in Europe and doing well at home more so than say, Spanish, German or English teams as their respective leagues are less competitive and pressurising. Hence, i do agree the CL should be a secondary focus for Italian teams. I merely highlighted this year's performances in the CL by Juve, because it showed some of the team's weakness early on.

As for personnel involving Juventus. I don't think the team needs much improving. And as you've said a Scudetto-winning team doesn't need much fixing. But you can always tweak it. :D I think our midfield is in dire need of some serious revamping, especially in terms of a fantasista. As for the other positions, i think most Juventini are content with the defence and the offense. Although a little cover can be brought in after the World Cup.
 

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Discussion Starter #12
fellas, i never said that i regreted winning the scudetto.

maybe i didnt explain myself, what i meant was that winning this scudetto might actually destroy us of having european and serie a success next season.

we have problems in the team, and before winning the scudetto, we were already fixing them. but now we are not!!

i havent lossed faith adel 10, i think we all know what moggi is like and if we didnt win that scudetto, with the players he was buying, we cuold have the scudetto and had european success for the next few years.

thats the point i'm trying to make.

i'm all for being champions if italy again...but i would have rather waited another season to build a team which would be multiple scudetto winners than just 2002 scudetto winners.
 

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There are dangers that a trophy masks more than it should and justifies what shouldn't be. The weaknesses of last season were there for all to see. Credit where its due, the margin of victory was very slim. If anyone were to go on about the 'what-ifs', the biggest one would surely concern Inter's total collapse.

You do not fix when it ain't broken? I disagree. Your competition hasn't been and won't be idling their summer away. Between now and Sept, there will be tons of analyses on a season's worth of data. Whoever does the best 2nd-guessing from there will possess a crucial, if not decisive advantage. Still, you've gotta do your homework first and that means fixing your problems from within. An obvious strength this season could well be exploited as a weakness in the next. CUG's concern is that the team hasn't been seen to be working on their failings exposed last season. He's understandably aggrieved given the current 'progress' in the way of transfers. To be fair however, things are much more complicated this summer due to the WC. Some are praying for a good showing to dramatically inflate their market values while others just don't want to be distracted for now etc ... the situation is at best tentative currently.

Whatever it is, Moggi has probably already identified his targets, laying the groundwork with potential deals (options, pre-contracts etc) and planning sabotage/counter-measures. For obvious reasons, you can't make these known. Remember how we hooked Trez amid all the speculation pointing him to Milan during Euro2k? He turned out to be France's ace and fortunately for us, very much ours as well ... patience man!

Juve will do well to bank of its core squad of players who won the Scudetto. They deserve that faith. There're good chances that they will improve given more time together ... but will that be enough? Basically, you can't work on what you don't have - we could use that alternative source of creativity, lots of flair, competent width and cover. Here's hoping this will be somewhere on that secret transfer agenda up there.
 

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This year we have a wonderful moment when finally Juve win the scudetto. We beat the hell out all Juve hater and broke them to pieces.

Next year.. well, it's not going to be easy for us.. some of the team really prepare them selves for the next season.. they're trying to snatched the tittle away from us.

So, CUG, relax.. sank your body on the couch.. drink a beer.. play some music and enjoy the scene.. when the next season is coming.. we better prepare our selves for the battle.. :D

PS:
I never lost my faith on you, CUG..so you better not dissapoint me;)
 

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Discussion Starter #17
:) lets not turn this forum into a Romance fourm now adel 10 ...:tongue:

see what juve does to us, it makes us fall in love with each other....;)

what a club!!
 

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GEE.. CUG??:rolleyes:

What make u think... that.. I..:horny: ??????


Well, Okay.. Lets get :fero: and :nasty: 4 the next season


Ciao
 
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