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Discussion Starter #1
.....Is rubbish AND Frustrating!!!

Every week it's the same old system, which is basically a 4-5-1, with Eto'o as the lone striker! :mad:

Neither Guily or Ronaldinho are strikers, so we play with five midfielders, which is frustrating as all good teams should have a formidable front pairing!

Madrid, have these great strikers with Ronaldo, Raul and Michael Owen, in fact so many strikers they just gave away Morienties!

We have.....Eto'o, and NOTHING else!

We URGENTLY need to sign a top striker to partner the Cameroonian hitman, and Rijkaard needs to alter his system and play with TWO strikers!!!
 

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To play with two strikers we'd need to drop someone of the squad. I suppose you'll say to drop Giuly, but we'd have no width except for the wingbacks, whose main task is still defending.
I think it will be difficult to alter the system with the players we have (or with players we don't have :)) My favourite was always the simple 4-4-2 but, we have too many players, that don't fit to that formation.
The fact that we lack another class striker is a totally different story and hopefully it is taken care of by the board.
Besides, Ronaldinho and Giuly are playing so ofensively, that the 4-5-1 changes to 4-3-3 most of the time.
 

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I dont think that the system is failing, moreso that the tiredness is highlighting its incapabilities. When teams like Valencia come and concede to a draw at the first whistle it is evident that our system is enforcing the rivals adaptation of play.

Saying that I feel we might need some minor tweeks in order to suprise the opposition. One might be switching Ronaldinho to the other side and giving him more freedom. My personal favourite however would be to give Messi minutes. Its the second half of the season so he wont burn out and from his form in the sudamerica nobody can deny his level. I feel he is ready and able to perform at this level. I dont look at Cesc, despite the difference in position and say he is any more developed to be able to play in this level and Messi isnt as the latter is superior. He could play right midfield and have a Ronaldinho role. This way they would create space for eachother as the opposition wouldnt know who to mark as one would be left free, similar to Deco and Xavi.
 

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The system is good and I like it and it's very offensive, it depends on the players the final result, as every system indeed. It's true that we play with only with one striker and even when Larsson was fit, one of them was in the wing.

It depends on what you like: playing with wings or not. IMO, the wings open the defenses, especially in wide pitches like the Camp Nou, so you can have more spaces. But even if you consider Ronaldinho and Giuly as midfielders, they're very offensive. It's true that their contribution in the goal ranking is not high at all, but they're still attacking players. Not only this, Xavi and Deco are very more attacking midfielders than defensive. So we play with 5 attacking players with the contributions of Belletti and Gio too. I think that there's no need to panic, we're the the team that has scored more goals with 36 goals (4 more than Madrid) and the team that has received less goals after Valencia. So I don't see the problem in the system.

About Madrid, they also play with one striker, Ronaldo and occasionally with 2, if he meets Owen. Raul is lately more an attacking midfielder or a playmaker than a striker and you can see his contribution (4 goals).

As Saviola7 said, if something is working fine, do not fix it. Last year we started with a 4-2-3-1 system, it was the fashion in Spain with the vitories of Del Bosque and Benitez with it. We sucked at that time. When Davids came, Rijkaard changed the system to 4-3-3 to adapt the team to the Dutch and it began to work fine. So the difference was not (only) Davids, also the tactical changes.

If you play a 4-4-2 with a diamond (I guess that you say so), Ronaldinho would play behind the strikers, leaving the left wing and Giuly would disappear from the team with another striker instead of him. Then you would lose the wings, since Deco and Xavi would not go to that zone and Belletti and Gio are still side backs. IMO, it's better to attack close defenses with wings, because the rival's side backs must play near them and it leaves more spaces in the center of their defense. If you do not play with wings, the side backs can help the center backs in their tasks and there're less spaces in the middle, right where you focus all your attack.

In any case, it depends on what you like. It's not about having more or less reason in it, it's about what you prefer to see.
 

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You know what the problem is, Ronaldinho doesn't fit this system! He needs to be in the center of the team to create! We were playing better when Larsson and Eto'o played together!
 

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Barcawinner said:
You know what the problem is, Ronaldinho doesn't fit this system! He needs to be in the center of the team to create! We were playing better when Larsson and Eto'o played together!
When we played with Etoo and Larrson, Ronnie was still in the same position as he is now...
 

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Saviola7 said:
When we played with Etoo and Larrson, Ronnie was still in the same position as he is now...
Yes, but we played better though. So I think the best for us is to;;

Larsson--Eto'o
--Ronaldinho--

BTW its not as if how the players walk on the field is exactly as it is on paper......
 

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Barcawinner said:
Yes, but we played better though. So I think the best for us is to;;

Larsson--Eto'o
--Ronaldinho--

BTW its not as if how the players walk on the field is exactly as it is on paper......
i dont think that we played better with Larrson...
We had a "run" and we could have played with Busquets and Dutruel in the attack, we still would have won :) :D:D
 

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Saviola7 said:
i dont think that we played better with Larrson...
We had a "run" and we could have played with Busquets and Dutruel in the attack, we still would have won :) :D:D
The main difference between our perfomances nowadays and at the beguinning of the season is tiredness, especially from Xavi who has gone downhill, and perhaps Deco too. Also teams may have adapted better to our tactical approach. I don´t see the pressure on the ball we used to display either. New faces and perhaps a change of system would help us in the second half of the season. After all we have changed 3 times since Rijkaard arrived, the second time more in style (more attacking) than in formation.
 

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I personally don't think they are tired. According to the players i.e. Xavi and Ronnie for eg, they didnt even want the break, they were flowing and they were doing it superbly, the break just 'killed' the flow.....don't worry they'll be back.

For example before the penalty miss, Barca were playing like we were used to. Once Eto'o missed the kick, not because he didnt strike it well but because he was a bit unlucky, the team lost its morale and faith, probably started thinking "if we can't score from the spot, how else would we do it?" Some of u might think of it as rubbish talk, but IMO i find it to be true. Plus they had come back from a defeat, in which the papers had a field day. No worries Eto'o revived the hopes, he proved he, and Barca can still do it. The team will start flowing again and God help RC Santander next week...
 

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Barca_AT19 said:
I personally don't think they are tired. According to the players i.e. Xavi and Ronnie for eg, they didnt even want the break, they were flowing and they were doing it superbly, the break just 'killed' the flow.....don't worry they'll be back.

For example before the penalty miss, Barca were playing like we were used to. Once Eto'o missed the kick, not because he didnt strike it well but because he was a bit unlucky, the team lost its morale and faith, probably started thinking "if we can't score from the spot, how else would we do it?" Some of u might think of it as rubbish talk, but IMO i find it to be true. Plus they had come back from a defeat, in which the papers had a field day. No worries Eto'o revived the hopes, he proved he, and Barca can still do it. The team will start flowing again and God help RC Santander next week...
I think the symptoms of tiredness started to appear before the break. We had a few lucky wins that hide that fact. I have also read from a few players that the team was tired. Just look at the amount of times the opposition have had scoring chances and compare it with the first games. We reached our peak in the RM game and since then it has been an slow but continuos degrading in perfomances. Perhaps the demands of the system, the little rotation especially in midfield, and the fact that we don´t have athlets in midfield have contributed to these worse perfomances. If we go down because we miss a penalty in the first 5 minutes of a game something is seriously wrong with our mentality.
 

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Angel_Culé said:
I think the symptoms of tiredness started to appear before the break. We had a few lucky wins that hide that fact. I have also read from a few players that the team was tired. Just look at the amount of times the opposition have had scoring chances and compare it with the first games. We reached our peak in the RM game and since then it has been an slow but continuos degrading in perfomances. Perhaps the demands of the system, the little rotation especially in midfield, and the fact that we don´t have athlets in midfield have contributed to these worse perfomances. If we go down because we miss a penalty in the first 5 minutes of a game something is seriously wrong with our mentality.
The lack of rotation must have had an effect, it's practically impossible for it not to have.

But I would like to point out that we aren't out of form, really. There is an element of tiredness, and with Ronaldinho not playing as well as he can/should, our fluency will be hit. But I think, as Zyad has pointed out in a different thread, people are taking the tighter scores to heart, and falling for the critics comments. The Sociedad game is an excellent example. News clips and TV reports, and some misguided rival fans, are under the impression that we were lucky or undeserving of a win, because it was "only" 1-0 and late on at that. Yet viewing the game showed differently. We dominated, and Sociedad deserved NOTHING. Teams more and more are just packing their box against us, and with the adding of injuries and tiredness to opponents going for an almost "stereotype Italian" approach to football, we're not going to look good all the time. The Valencia game where we drew, we dominated completely. The Getafe game, we were in charge the first half, and there is no way you can say they deserved a win MORE than we did based on the actual evidence. We were in charge against Levante also, their skilled counter attacking means little in terms of actually dominating a game.

Villareal is the first game where we have both suffered a loss and deserved to lose clearly. I assume that we will sign someone, and eventually some injured guys will come back, and hopefully Ronaldinho will start playing his way again.

Point is, if our current form (4 wins and a draw from 6) is us OUT of form, then the rest of La Liga better pray we don't get IN form. :rollani: We're not AS sharp as we were, but how could we be under the circumstances? Not long ago, we would lose under the same circumstances. And frankly, looking at our 2 championship rivals so far, I fail to see how they can call US lucky OR out of form.
 

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The firsty post here is a bit of a joke comparing us with the unmentionables as if they were better or something. The difference is still 7 points and we have already completely ouclassed them in every department once this season. The simple truth is that Raúl and Owen would be warming their arses on the bench here at CN.
 

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Valdes said:
.....Is rubbish AND Frustrating!!!

Every week it's the same old system, which is basically a 4-5-1, with Eto'o as the lone striker! :mad:

Neither Guily or Ronaldinho are strikers, so we play with five midfielders, which is frustrating as all good teams should have a formidable front pairing!

Madrid, have these great strikers with Ronaldo, Raul and Michael Owen, in fact so many strikers they just gave away Morienties!

We have.....Eto'o, and NOTHING else!

We URGENTLY need to sign a top striker to partner the Cameroonian hitman, and Rijkaard needs to alter his system and play with TWO strikers!!!


-Playing with 2 strikers would be a total change to the system. It's not a simple as adding a striker and dropping one of the wingers... it's more complicated that that, and it would cause a LOT of problems in adjusting for the team, which has been playing this way not only with this year's team, but also in the second half of last year after Davids arrived.
-We DON'T need a striker to partner Eto'o, we need to to either
A) Be a substitute for him, either to rest him when a game is already won, or in case he gets injured.
and
B) To sub him in to play WITH Eto'o late in a match where the original formation isn't working and a change is needed (this is how Larsson was used before the injury)
-I think you are over-reacting towards the whole system (and misinterpreting it) It's not a 4-5-1, it's a 4-3-3. Dinho and Giuly are NOT pure wingers (because they go inside the box more than a typical winger would), and they are definitely NOT midfielders. They're much more offensive than that. This 4-3-3 is NOT crap, it has been played since last January and has gotten Barça results that pretty much better than any other team in the world (expect for Arsenal), so obviously the system is not the problem. Barça's potential problems this year are not going to come from the system they are employing, but having the personnel necessary to execute it due to the injuries in the squad. You can be sure that if they do get a striker in the transfer window, that striker will be used exactly the same way Larsson was: Not as a starting partner to Eto'o, but as a replacement and as an option when things go wrong in a match.

PS VBI... thanks for the reference... ;)
 

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Our current system works very well, as the results from this season show. It's probably the best possible tactic for this team. I can't think of a single change that Rijkaard should do right now.
But we should certainly sign a backup striker, currently we are too dependable of Eto'o. If something should happen to him right now, it would be a massive blow, as we have no replacements whatsoever.
 

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Discussion Starter #20
Roger said:
The first post here is a bit of a joke comparing us with the unmentionables as if they were better or something. The difference is still 7 points and we have already completely ouclassed them in every department once this season. The simple truth is that Raúl and Owen would be warming their arses on the bench here at CN.
OK, sorry for upsetting you Roger, but you and one or two others seem to have misinterpreted the point I was trying to make with this thread.

The Madrid comparison, was only to highlight that they have three top class strikers in their squad, and we only have Eto'o.
Also, If Raul and Owen would only make the bench at CN, then that's only because Rijkaard could'nt fit them into this system he plays! :wallbang:

I started this thread straight after the game the other night, when I felt frustrated as hell, at having to wait until the 80th minute to get a goal to scrape past ten man Sociedad.
Even then we almost chucked it away, but for two superb stops from Valdes!

In fact the last three games games at the CN have been torture!
The Sociedad game, Valencia, 79th minute to get a draw and Levante 85th minute Eto'o wondergoal, to scrape a 2-1 win.

What I'm really trying to say is, "it's goals that count". :thmbup:
We can play all the pretty passing stuff we want, and Ronnie can do his party piece magic trick, but if it does'nt result in a goal then what use is it?

Madrid have hammered Albacete 6-1, and that same Levante side 5-0, this season, while we never manage to pile up these sort of scores.
I'd just like some easier nights, instead of huffing and puffing until late in the game! :scared:
 
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