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Discussion Starter #1
Well listen to this here in Australia a convicted sex molester was taken out on day release to go Shopping yes that's right Shopping.And while his minder was receiving change from a shop assistant the Crim escaped leaving the Moron authorities to stage a manhunt for him.
Going Shopping well no wonder Jail is like a 5 star hotel people are living on these street and these Criminals,Murderers etc are making a mockery of the system.What an absolute Croc.May as well let the serial killers go out for a night on the town and when catch the Child Molesterer they can shove him up their Culos.
 

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Sounds like Sweden... but in Sweden even murderers are allowed to be out in freedom during their supposed time in prison. Is really a mockery of the victims.
 

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Falcão83 said:
You guys better be joking. Cant belive it.
Not long ago we had a report in one of the investigating type of shows in Sweden. They showed how a guy that had murdered two teens was able to get permissions (is it called that? when they are out of prison) all the time. You can imagine how upset the mother of the ones killed was. She didn't even know that he was able to go out in town without surveillance. He could as well kill more people, as nothing stopped him from doing that. If I remember correctly that was only 4 years after his crime. Thank god Hannibal Lecter isn't in a Swedish prison.
 

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I think every decent juridical system has this concept. Of course the victims have rights, but that is something else than having the right to revenge. People forget this idea of soo called "holidays" is very functional. One underestimates what being locked up for severla years does to someone. If such prisoners are released just like that, the chance that they fall back into criminal behaviiour is immense. Such short periods of going back into siociety can make the change easier and the chance that society will be a safe place, bigger. The condition of course is that psychologists determine who is ready for it and who isn't.
 

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gOD said:
Such short periods of going back into siociety can make the change easier and the chance that society will be a safe place, bigger. The condition of course is that psychologists determine who is ready for it and who isn't.
I think people feel very "safe" knowing that murderers walk among them unchecked. It could also end up being a question of safety for the criminal, because this is easily the situation where toughts and actions of revenge by victims may come into place.
 

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Discussion Starter #7
Exactly the Law is opened up to allowing victims to gain revenge.I cannot believe the joke of the legal system.Yep Psychologist's determine who's ok to go back into the Community well I hope they sleep well at night when Incidents occur.
It's so obvious with past happenings that the majority of these offenders are'nt well enough to return into society.How the Criminals must love the Legal system they're allowed to galavant on the outside and spot their Prey while serving their sentences Gees what a great world.:rolleyes:
 

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JKris said:
I think people feel very "safe" knowing that murderers walk among them unchecked. It could also end up being a question of safety for the criminal, because this is easily the situation where toughts and actions of revenge by victims may come into place.
But what people "feel" is in this case very wrong. What do wexpect from policy makers, that they do what we want or that they do the right thing?
 

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gOD said:
The condition of course is that psychologists determine who is ready for it and who isn't.
There's the problem right there.
 

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Humbird said:
There's the problem right there.
I disagree. I have seen (observed, not actually been treated by...yet) excellent phychologists. They are probably the best qualified for this particular scenario.
 

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A: You punish people.
B: You try and reform people.

When you go by A you rarely succeed in 'creating' better persons when their sentences are up.
When you go by B you will some times face massive disappointment and some times tragedy.

Personally I root for B. For all it's mishaps I think it's a lot better than A.
 

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I disagree Borba. As far are murderers and child molesters are concerned, the answer is a whack upside the head with a sturdy 2x4 plank.....not a pyschologist.
 

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Humbird said:
There's the problem right there.
Yes and no. Yes mistakes happen. Nothing is 100% solid and psychologists are only human. But for every mistake that happens hundreds and thousands correct decisions are made. Unfortunately the cases that succeed the ex-cons that do re-integrate thanks to this mechanismn aren't juicy stories to elobate by persones that for some strange reason are called journalists
 

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Glen said:
A: You punish people.
B: You try and reform people.
Or, you punish them so much that you do reform them. It's also a lot cheaper to shove a prisoner in a dingy little dungeon than it is to let prisoners wander around in public. That's the problem with our liberal (where have I started a sentence like that before?) prison systems. Often, we are stranded in the middle ground, making prisons as easy as possible without helping the prisoners.

I choose A.
 

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Bastin said:
Or, you punish them so much that you do reform them. It's also a lot cheaper to shove a prisoner in a dingy little dungeon than it is to let prisoners wander around in public.
That would be great unfortunately it's not how things work. The only way you'll change the is into frustrated, broken, aggresive and revengeful individuals.
 

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Putting a person in a small cell for an extended period of time tends to make them go crazy.
 

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Glen said:
When you go by B you will some times face massive disappointment and some times tragedy.
Generally they perform crimes when they are free from their prison sentence, so people have an wellfounded right to be afraid. Often the repeatcrimes is not as serious as murders, but robberies and assaults is VERY common.

Putting a person in a small cell for an extended period of time tends to make them go crazy.
Problem is, they already where that.

Prisons shouldn't be a institution that people want to come back too. With great food, cable TV and so on. and letting them out so they can commit more crimes is very irresponsible. almost all criminals are repeat ones.

Now I do not care if simple robbers or first time criminals (for less than murder/rape) gets the more nice treatment, but the hardened ones...
 

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They just need outlets for their craziness. Give them some a few reams of paper and a couple of pencils. That ought to hold them for a few years.
 

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Bastin said:
Or, you punish them so much that you do reform them. It's also a lot cheaper to shove a prisoner in a dingy little dungeon than it is to let prisoners wander around in public. That's the problem with our liberal (where have I started a sentence like that before?) prison systems. Often, we are stranded in the middle ground, making prisons as easy as possible without helping the prisoners.

I choose A.

Well... I don't think the alternative is either dingy dungeon or convicts walking around in public..... A prison should not be a holiday-in, nor should it be medieval in scope or construction. But the purpose must be to make 'better' people of the ones sentenced to be there. You talk about punishing them so much that it reforms them.... like how?
I understand (yet disagree) when someone talks about the severity of punishment being a 'good' deterrant for people to commit crimes, but we're talking people who've already been sentenced here. Can you point to any indicator that more severe punishment, tougher treatment, worse fascilities etc. improves people for when they get out? Even if it's only a financial one?

The only argument in favor of doing so is the modern version of eye for an eye. Simply saying that he/she deserves everything he/she get's because he/she wronged the laws of society.

That is not saying that I think we should try and 'save' every bastard out there. I'm talking about overall scope only.
 

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How do you reform someone when after their sentence, it's virtually impossible for them to be assimilated back into society, because no one wants to employ people with criminal convictions?

I've met people while working for the employment service, who have een in jail and try desperately to become a 'normal' citizen, but they cannot get work.

Ok, maybe that's justice, but maybe the effort on the Government's behalf should be after they are released.

Speaking of crazy justic systems. Yes, a lot of questions need to be asked. It seems crimes against property are punished more severly than some sex crimes. And there was also a report (Evening Standard I believe) that traffic offenders (including minor offences like paying fines) outnumber burglars in our jails.

Just speaking my thoughts and not through any science; I think the Goverment should work more at preventing rather than curing these people. Whether that's through a stronger/stricter education system, or a change in welfare, etc - I don't know.

Maybe we need compulsory military service to kick some of these potential thugs into shape.

I know I'm moving in various tangents but I know what I mean :tongue: :D
 
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