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Discussion Starter #1
I know it`s a bit early, but I thought it was about time to get "down with it", especially now when there is so little activity. So let the coach and the players do the "where only looking one match ahead"-stuff, and let us think ahead. This time, with focus on tactics.

Many of you have expressed your ideas regarding our tactics, and I tend to agree...the 4-2-2-2 system we used for most of this season is not even a tactic, the 4-4-2 diamond system make us vulnerable and the 5-4-1 system is too defensive.

I have given this a lot of talk, and found out what would be, in my mind :rolleyes: ;) , the ideal tactic. A tactic that is stabil, yet flexible. I was thinking about the 3-3-1-3 used by Argentina.

First of all, the three back line, like the one we played in Barca. Two man-marking defenders, and in the middle Iván Helguera, with a libero role much like the one Mathias Sammer used to fill. This will give our nr6 the liberty to decide wether he should support the attack or hold back in defense.

Second, the wing backs, and the defensive midfielder. This tactic will give our fullbacks the oppurtunity to play as wingers.

Then we have Zidane, who fills the 'hole' between midfield and attack. Of course the one to provide the strikers with those stinging passes.

Last, but not least. The three-pronged attack with Figo and Raúl just behind the striker.

------------Casillas

--------Hierro---------Pavón
--------------Helguera

Salgado----Makelele----R Carlos

--------------Zidane

-------Figo-----------Raúl
------------Morientes

reserves:

-------------César

--------Mr X--------Rubén
--------------Borja

----------Cambiasso
Miñambres---------R Bravo

------------Guti

------Macca-----Solari
------------Portillo

If we want a defensive approach, we can use Solari instead of Morientes. This will be the same team that beat Barca at Camp Nou (just switch Guti and Figo).

But this tactic could also be very offensive. With only the DMC and the two central defenders holding back:

--------------Casillas

--------Hierro---------Pavón

--------------Makelele

Salgado--Zidane--Helguera--R Carlos

--------Figo---------------Raúl
---------------Morientes

This is just my idea of thinking loud, making an overwiew, to see which players to keep and who we want to buy. Share your thoughts on this one :)
 

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Go for 400, Raúl!
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I could agree with you in the overall, but, in fact, this is the 5-3-2 scheme we played with at the end of the 1999/2000 season and at the Paris final. Then it was:


Campo-Helguera-Karanka
Salgado R.Carlos
Redondo
Macca Raúl (Savio)

Anelka (Raúl) - Morientes.

So, as you can see, there's nothng new under the sun...
 

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Discussion Starter #3 (Edited)
The squad

According to my plan, the first XI will be:

Casillas; Hierro, Helguera, Pavón; Salgado, Makelele, R Carlos; Zidane; Figo, Raúl; Morientes

the bench: César, Carlos, Rubén, Cambiasso, Flavio, Miñambres, Bravo, Solari, Macca, Guti, Munitis and Portillo

The players who should/could be sold are:

Karanka and Savio (contract issues) Tote (decided by the club)

Campo, Baljic, Congo, Celades, Rivera and Aganzo (simply not good enough)

Geremi and Flavio (if we get a good offer)

Players who should decide their future soon:

Álvaro (should he be loaned out?) Fernando (should we bring him back from Valladolid?) and what about Corona (where is he at now?)

This will make a squad like this:

Keepers: Casillas, César and Carlos

CD`s: Hierro, Helguera, Pavón, Rubén and Borja.

Fullbacks: Salgado, Roberto Carlos, Miñambres and Raúl Bravo.

DMC`s: Makelele and Flavio or Cambiasso (if we don`t get Esteban we should keep Flavio)

OMC`s: Zidane and Guti (Corona and Fernando)

Wingers: Figo, Solari, Macca and Munitis (Álvaro)

Strikers: Raúl, Morientes and Portillo

A squad of 23 players (more or less), could need another defender...
 

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Discussion Starter #4
Gwydno,

I know the tactic is not a new one. In fact, it is a mixture of the 99/00 tactic and some of the matches we played this season. This just illustrates the best position for each player, as I see it.
 

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Go for 400, Raúl!
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To El Niño

Well, it can be OK if you're talking just about next wednesday's final.
But if you're drawing our team for next season, do you realize this has been exactly our first XI along most of this season?
I don't know how do you feel, but even if this team win the CL, I won't feel completely satisfied, simply because I think this should a be a football machine that should have won or at least fought till the end for everything -and in style.
This team has worked only when all the eleven players have been at their 100%. When any piece has failed, not only the whole system has become weak, brainless and unoffensive, but we have found there's no accurate replacement in our bench. Solari and Guti have made good matches, but they are eventual replacements to fix up some disfunctions along a match, but we can't count on them to re-built the team.
We need a central defender that can really play besides or instead of Hierro, and SOMEONE (now it seems Vieira won't come, maybe Fernando?) to balance the midfield, since Helguera must be prepared to play at the defense, I think. But this is something we all have already talked about and most of us agree on this, I think.

You talk about the players that should leave. well, I would simply kick Flavio's ass to send him as far as possible. As for the rest of the players you would fire, I agree with you.

You talk about Corona. In fact he plays for Zaragoza since last season and he couldn't earn a place for himself between their first XI, so I think you could just forget him. Just another good player wasted.
 

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Discussion Starter #6
Mercado

Then, the summer-mercado will be like this:

OUT:
Savio leaves for PSG (€10 mill)
Karanka returns to Athletic Bilbao (free transfer)
Tote makes a permanent deal with Valladolid
Geremi is bought by Chelsea for €10 mill.
Flavio makes the move to Juventus, the Turin club pay €14 mill.
Campo goes to Mallorca for €5.5 mill.
Málaga pay us €4 mill for Celades and Congo
Rivera decides to stay on at Marseille
Espanyol want to keep Aganzo
Baljic is released from his contract.

This brings us €43.5 million, which we should invest in a central defender and perhaps a right back or even a striker...
 

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Discussion Starter #7
nd her`s the good part

Gwydno said:
But if you're drawing our team for next season, do you realize this has been exactly our first XI along most of this season?
Yes, and here`s the good part, the players who are on their way IN. :)

After realizing that Vieira wants to stay on with double winners Arsenal, Valdano finds out that now is the time to bring back Esteban Cambiasso. Eventually he will develop into the commanding midfielder Redondo was, meanwhile we have to rely on Makelele :)

Hierro is getting old, and Pérez wants to find a worthy replacement. Nesta decides that he wants to help his beloved Lazio, so el presidente turns to Lucio, who despite going down with 3-0, impressed in the final of the Champions League. The price is €25 million.

Cragnotti is getting tired of Crespo who refuse a salary-cut. The Lazio chief finnaly agree to sell the argentinian to a cut-price £32 million.

Doctors tell Manuel Pablo that he will never kick a futbol again, and so Lendoiro destroy the contract. However, Pablo heals in a miraculous way, and signs for Real Madrid on free transfer.

How about this for next season?

---------------Iker o César

-----------Hierro----------Lucio
----------(Pavón)-Helguera

---M Pablo------------------------R Carlos
--------------------Makelele

--------------------Zidane

----------Figo-----------------Raúl
-------------------Crespo

Don`t know if the two last purchases is really neseccary (even though they would strenghten the team) because I like Salgado and Moro and don`t want to see them go :depress:

A new defender is needed, though, Lucio or no Lucio....
 

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I agree with you that it really is high time that we managed to sell some players.Baljic,Savio,Munitis,I think 2 of those 3 guys have to go.We really have a lot of potential to recouup a lot of the money we spend.We have 4 defensive midfielders on our roster,and that is excluding Cambiasso.We can sell 2 of them as well.

As for tactics,I'll elaborate on my dream for this later,when we have a sure idea of what the squad will be next season.But as for so far this season,the formation el nino wants is pretty much exactly the formation I wanted tried out way back in October.

But I also knew at the same time that Del Bosque would not try it,he seemed to have completely shelved it.Then he tried it (or rather sth similar to it)against Barca,but he used it as a defensive ploy, and I knew again that Del Bosque wouldn't stick to it, unless he can use it as an attacking formation(something which is perfectly possible IMO) and Real would never play with a defensive tactic.
 

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I wouldn't want to speculate on our formation so soon either. Not when some of the incoming players are not confirmed yet. ;)
But all these times, with the class and qualities of the players we have, I'm always for the concept of Ranieri: Players should be 'sensible' enough to play in a way to complement the other 10 players on field. This means playing in the best possible formation in the team's point of view and the players' positions from their point of view.
Of course this is difficult in concept but if we can't do it, no other teams can.. :D
 
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