Xtratime Community banner

1 - 17 of 17 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
9,958 Posts
Discussion Starter #1
In this article in the Sunday Herald Rangers Chief Executive Martin Bain explains that Rangers are distancing themselves from the talk coming out of Celtic Park. Articles like the one on CQN help to build the myth that it is going to happen. Alot of Celtic supporters are now waiting to join the Premiership in 2007.

Some points I agree with.

Bain- “You only get in somewhere if you’re invited and I just don’t know if there is a willingness to invite us down. I hope our fans will see we are being totally honest with them”

Chivo- That is just one of the stumbling blocks. The old firm have never been invited and all the noises coming from the Premiership are that they never will be invited.

Bain- “I understand the mission statement coming from their board because their belief is that if Celtic are going to grow as a club and a brand and aspire to be a better football team then it does need a catalyst for change”

Chivo- Celtic do have big plans for the future and fair play to them. It does seem to rely alot on this catalyst though and that's why they are so determined to get the message over that they are going to the Premiership. I have reservations on whether their great plans will get off the ground if they are not to leave the SPL.

Bain- “Alex and I have had a couple of interesting debates about this and I think we see Stuttgart is a case in point. They have a young team which has done well in the Champions League."

Chivo- I've been arguing this from day one. You don't need money to compete at the highest level, or at a level higher than the Old Firm have reached so far. That aside the Old Firm have a big income than alot of Premiership sides at the moment so an extra few buckets of cash are not guarateed to fix the problem in Europe.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
7,978 Posts
I don't think there's much point in Rangers actively pursuing this Premiership thing anyway. Let Celtic do all the campaigning and canvassing they want. If it ever bears fruit (which I doubt) then surely Rangers will be invited along as well.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
9,958 Posts
Discussion Starter #3
Angle_eyes said:
I don't think there's much point in Rangers actively pursuing this Premiership thing anyway. Let Celtic do all the campaigning and canvassing they want. If it ever bears fruit (which I doubt) then surely Rangers will be invited along as well.
True. The Old Firm are a package and no one is going alone. I think Bain just wants to ensure Rangers fans are not looking forward to 2007 in the same way a section of the Celtic support are. If it happens then fair enough but if it doesn't then there will be alot of disappointed people.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
7,017 Posts
At the end of the day, when Celtic get an invite into the Premiership or elsewhere then Rangers will be only too happy to join us. They can continue their fake "we're committed to Scottish Football" stance all they want - we all know it'll all be hollow words anyway when it comes to the crunch in a few years.

At least Celtic are being upfront about their plans. Stuttgart are out of Europe by the way, and didn't even qualify for the Champions League this season, so i fail to see how they're an example of what any team should be aspiring to.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
9,958 Posts
Discussion Starter #5
King_Henrik said:
At the end of the day, when Celtic get an invite into the Premiership or elsewhere then Rangers will be only too happy to join us. They can continue their fake "we're committed to Scottish Football" stance all they want - we all know it'll all be hollow words anyway when it comes to the crunch in a few years.
Rangers fans won't be disappointed by the board's words, Celtic fans could be potentially with false hope.

King_Henrik said:
At least Celtic are being upfront about their plans. Stuttgart are out of Europe by the way, and didn't even qualify for the Champions League this season, so i fail to see how they're an example of what any team should be aspiring to.
Stuttgart finished 4th in the Bundesliga in 2003/04 so missed out on qualification this year for the Champions League. They play in a more competative league where a top two spot is not all but guaranteed.

They have though been further than Celtic in the Champions League so that's why they are a team to aspire to. Last season they got to the last 16 where they were knocked out by Chelsea.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
7,017 Posts
chivoexpiatorio said:
Rangers fans won't be disappointed by the board's words, Celtic fans could be potentially with false hope.



Stuttgart finished 4th in the Bundesliga in 2003/04 so missed out on qualification this year for the Champions League. They play in a more competative league where a top two spot is not all but guaranteed.

They have though been further than Celtic in the Champions League so that's why they are a team to aspire to. Last season they got to the last 16 where they were knocked out by Chelsea.
Something has to give in the current format of European football, and sooner or later it will.

Stuttgart have never qualified for a European final in recent years, we helped see to that. Infact i'd say that Celtic are a better team for Rangers to be aspiring to. :)
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
9,958 Posts
Discussion Starter #7
King_Henrik said:
Something has to give in the current format of European football, and sooner or later it will.
Really? Well to date the facts are that Stuttgart have reached the last 16 and Celtic have not- fact.

King_Henrik said:
Stuttgart have never qualified for a European final in recent years, we helped see to that. Infact i'd say that Celtic are a better team for Rangers to be aspiring to. :)
I think we'd rather set our sites on Champions League progress than UEFA Cup progress- thanks anyway. That's why we'll aspire to teams like Stuttgart in that area. You can keep your UEFA Cup loser memories and keep trying to relive them while we try to make progress in the Champions League.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
7,017 Posts
chivoexpiatorio said:
I think we'd rather set our sites on Champions League progress than UEFA Cup progress- thanks anyway. That's why we'll aspire to teams like Stuttgart in that area. You can keep your UEFA Cup loser memories and keep trying to relive them while we try to make progress in the Champions League.
Qualifying for the Champions League next season would be a start.

If you suceed in doing that then you'll have made progress, good luck with your ambitions.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
9,958 Posts
Discussion Starter #9
King_Henrik said:
Qualifying for the Champions League next season would be a start.

If you suceed in doing that then you'll have made progress, good luck with your ambitions.
That might be your idea of progress but for us progress is getting to the last 16.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
7,017 Posts
chivoexpiatorio said:
That might be your idea of progress but for us progress is getting to the last 16.
No, i'm stating a fact that actually qualifying for the Champions League proper next season will be progress made for Rangers from this season.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
9,958 Posts
Discussion Starter #11
King_Henrik said:
No, i'm stating a fact that actually qualifying for the Champions League proper next season will be progress made for Rangers from this season.
We were in the group stages two seasons ago. We have failed once under McLeish at the Champions League qualifying stages, so have Celtic under O'Neill. We've not been beyond the group stages under McLeish, neither have Celtic under O'Neill. Therein lies the progress we are aspiring too.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
7,017 Posts
Rangers have been a joke-figure in European football under McLeish.

Martin O'Neill has beaten some of the top teams in Europe and qualified for a European final with Celtic.

I thank you.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
9,958 Posts
Discussion Starter #13
King_Henrik said:
Rangers have been a joke-figure in European football under McLeish.

Martin O'Neill has beaten some of the top teams in Europe and qualified for a European final with Celtic.

I thank you.
Has Martin O'Neill progressed any further than McLeish in Europe's top club competition? I did say that was the competition we were aspiring to progress in.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
6,529 Posts
Angle_eyes said:
I don't think there's much point in Rangers actively pursuing this Premiership thing anyway. Let Celtic do all the campaigning and canvassing they want. If it ever bears fruit (which I doubt) then surely Rangers will be invited along as well.
Yep - leave Celtic to do the constant dreaming, cause its never going to happen in 2007.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
4,690 Posts
Ooooooohhhh.......Get her.........:D
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
9,958 Posts
Discussion Starter #17
Seeing as CQN has another article today on Celtic's impending Premiership move I thought I'd post here. I have grave doubts the old firm will move, hope they don't and wish they would get on with Scottish Football.

It's all about excuses. The Old Firm need more money to compete with the big clubs apparently. Rubbish in my view. There is only one competition in European Club Football and despite being among the 20 Richest Clubs in Europe the Old Firm are lagging behind the rest. Throwing more money at it won't help.

Below are the last 16 clubs in this year's Champions league. Team's in Green are not in the 20 top richest clubs in Europe.

Real Madrid
Juventus
Porto
Internazionale
Barcelona
Chelsea
Werder Bremen
Olympique Lyonnais
Liverpool
Bayer Leverkusen
PSV Eindhoven
AS Monaco
Manchester United
Milan
Bayern München
Arsenal

So as you can see there are six clubs who have got further in the tournament this season than the Old Firm have with less money at their disposal. They have gone further than the Old Firm have ever gone in fact under the current competition format. So why should the Old Firm need more money to progress when these clubs are already doing it?

If you include this season and last season then that theory is reinforced. Porto and AS Monaco are in the last 16 this season and contested last year's final. Neither side is in the rich list. Deportivo La Coruña didn't make the last 16 this season but made the semi-finals last season- they are not in the rich list either.

Olympique Lyonnais have made the last 16 this season and made they also made the last 8 the season before- not in the rich list. VfB Stuttgart, Real Sociedad, Celta Vigo, Sparta Praha and Lokomotiv Moskva have all failed to make the last 16 this season but did so last season without being one of Europe's top 20 richest clubs.

It breeds a real pattern of overachievers and underachievers. Some supporters are not only getting shortchanged for their money but the clubs have got the cheek to say they need more money on top of their current income. We've see the overachievers , now lets look at the underachievers who make up the Top 20 rich list but not appeared in the last 16 of The Champions League in the last 2 seasons.

Best of the underachievers are the Scottish Clubs. Although they have not been past the group stages Celtic have reached this stage twice in the last two seasons and Rangers have made it once while still reaching qualification phase this year.

Next it's Lazio, AS Roma and Olympique Marseille who have only qualified for the Champions League competition once in the last two years and never been beyond the group stages.

Newcastle who have only qualified for the Champions League competition once in the last two years and never reached the group stages in that time.

Worst of the underachievers are Aston Villa, Manchester City, Spurs and Schalke who despite being in the Top 20 rich list have never quaified for the Champions League in the last two seasons.

Before Celtic and Rangers look to move elsewhere for more cash I think they should do something first. Become overachievers , for now they remain underachievers
 
1 - 17 of 17 Posts
Top