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Discussion Starter #1 (Edited)
The info below is compiled from Gazzetta.

http://www.gazzetta.it/speciali/sta...i/statistiche_squadra/2001/loghi_squadre.html


In favor Against
Atalanta: 4 5
Bologna: 2 4
Brescia: 9 4
Chievo: 10 10
Fiorentina: 2 7
Inter: 6 5
Juventus: 7 2
Lazio: 4 3
Lecce: 3 7
Milan: 9 3
Parma: 3 8
Perugia: 3 5
Piacenza: 7 6
Roma: 5 2
Torino: 8 6
Udinese: 11 5
Venezia: 4 15
Verona: 8 8


Most penalties given: Udinese (11), Chievo (10), Brescia (9), Milan (9)
Most penalties against: Venezia (15), Chievo (10), Parma (8), Verona (8)
Fewest penalties against: Juventus (2), Roma (2), Lazio (3), Milan (3)
Best +/- : Udinese (+6), Milan (+6), Juventus (+5), (Brescia +5)
Worst +/- : Venezia (-11), Parma (-5), Fiorentina (-5)

An observation:
The four teams getting the fewest penalties against were all in the top 5 for best defence. Juve 1st, Roma 2nd., Milan 3rd, Lazio 5th.

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Glen trying hard to discredit the penalty image...:tongue: :D


Lav
 

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Discussion Starter #3
Good call Lav. That was/is indeed the intention; the demystification of the "penalty issue".

So many people come out and say stuff that is simply unfounded. I just wanted to provide those people with some facts.

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Statistics can lie, not that I am claiming they are in this case.

But to kill the "Juve bribes the ref to get penalties" myth would take alot more then some statistics, even if the statistics are clearly claiming the opposite.

Cause you see joe average ( or Roberto average in this case ;) ) doesnt care about statistics, all he cares about is what he saw on "sunday", Juve "cheating" to win.

Its only hard core fans like us who gets into the depth of the leauge that can actually see through a couple of unlucky incidents, because we follow the leauge week in and week out.
But just like you will never be able to kill the "Italian football is boring" myth, you can never kill the Juve myth neither.
 

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Discussion Starter #5
I'm not foolish enough to believe anything else Dracula :).

However- the mantra must be opposed on occasion, and perhaps people will then be more open to notice that- when talking about how "Juve get's this" or "Juve get's that"- you must also consider that all the other teams penalties count the same.

I've previously posted a 10 year statistic which showed that Inter, Lazio and Udinese have gotten more penalties than Juve over the last decade, and with this years result, Milan and Roma are still right behind.

Juventus is the team conceeding the fewest penalties, and besides that being an object of allegations as well, just like this season, you can argue (at least I will :D) that not conceeding penalties is in no small part because of good defence. Looking over the last decade- a strong defence has been Juve's trademark all along.

That said- I do not argue that the refs. won't be less hessitant to whistle penalty against Venezia than against Juve. That isn't fair of course, but the same would be the case for the other top teams as shown.

The myth can never be killed I think, and it would be strange too, because it exists for Real, Bayern, United etc. too outside serie A albeit not quite as powerfull, but to take some of it's steam out would be very nice indeed.

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The lowdown is that refs is much more discussed in Italy compared to other leagues. I heard several Swedish referees pointing out the Italian referees as the best and mot proffesional.

The thing is, an team that attacks for the majority of the match will get more penalties than an team that defends.

But it is despite those points an favour to the big team ... and an favour to Juve when they meet Milan, I suspect Chamots owngoal to be an gift from the ref... no wait he was bribed, five choclate bars was enough... ;)
 
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