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I thought it was time we had one to discuss his various stupid statements, inept tactics & poor movements in the transfer market...
 

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The Wenger stuff comes up in almost every thread, that's why.

You won't ever hear me calling Wenger an idiot, but I'm finding it hard to believe he'll win us trophies again. 07/08 looked like being Wenger's new trophy-winning team, then he let it get dismantled without a fight and I was disillusioned, then he recovered it and we weren't far off the title last season, and now when we needed to kick on and improve that little bit more the early signs are that we've probably stood still at best or even gone backwards. Certainly, last season's team wouldn't have found themselves 0-3 down at home to West Brom, and if we can't beat newly-promoted teams at home, which is supposed to be the one thing Arsenal can do, then I don't know where we are anymore.

Still, that was only one game, and I still get swept up in the feeling sometimes that everything will click together once more. There is that lack of discipline though, that inability to defend properly throughout the team, that permeates everything. We just don't play like any other team out there, certainly not any other top team. I'm all for innovation, but there comes a time when, as they say on Dragons' Den, "I would kindly advise you not to waste any more time on this, because it won't get you anywhere".
 

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WENGER IS KING AND STAYS ON UNTIL HE SAYS ITS TIME TO GO!
 

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Long Live The King of Alsace ;)

http://www.arsenalnewsreview.co.uk/index.php?mact=News,cntnt01,detail,0&cntnt01articleid=1787&cntnt01origid=30&cntnt01returnid=42

Should be a Wenger thread though. Strange there hasn't been one before.

Criticism of him and the adulation.
How can that article say "we didn't defend well" and in the same mention say, "Drogba scored a goal that no other striker will score?"

I thought the defense actually did a nice job in and of itself, but they were left out to dry by the midfield on too many occasions.
 

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How can that article say "we didn't defend well" and in the same mention say, "Drogba scored a goal that no other striker will score?"

I thought the defense actually did a nice job in and of itself, but they were left out to dry by the midfield on too many occasions.
Exactly.

Honestly think Arsenal could have Baresi and Maldini in their prime and still leak goals as our midfield is all to often lazy and stupid.

AW needs to look at a persistent failing of ours. It is called defending as a team. What this squad\team has not improved on. For example, I take you back to Chelsea game last season when we lost 3 nil at home. Look at the first two goals, Arshavin did not track back, the CM was hoplessly out of position and we concede the crucial 1st goal. We repeat the trick again, this time on the right side with Nasri asleep allowing Cole to run in to set up the second. In both goals, analyse the defensive play of the team.

Sadly, we play Chelsea again, and we repeat the same trick. The same players (Cole and Drogba taking advantage of sloppy team defending. What was Nasri doing for the first goal? Why did two Arsenal players stand around Ramirez without putting pressure on the ball, thereby allowing him to pick a pass to Cole. How can our players be so hopelessly out of position that a simple ball can open them up in such a congested space? I may not be a Coach or professional footballer, but I know that when you play the high line it is paramount you put pressure on the ball and squeeze the line. So why have we made such individual and collective error and defended like school boys for the first goal? Why is it that it is the same players who consistently, cost us defensively?

In fact the top teams play us confident that if they keep it tight, we are bound to concede because we have a defensive strategy that allows for us to give up a goal. The evidence backs up this view. So why play as well as we did and throw it all away with such poor defending. Why can't our players learn from previous defensive mistakes? If you are missing your top players, it goes without saying that the replacement will not be as clinical. This is were you must compensate by defending properly.

Our defensive strategy is to press high up and force mistakes, this has been very effective especially against the poorer teams in the league. What I have noticed is our players become complacent and ill-disciplined, then we concede. Most of the time this poor defending is not punished because we out score the opposition. But when we play the better teams, they are quick to exploit the space we leave if we do not maintain our shape defensively. What is becoming apparent is we have now developed a bad habit from playing the weaker teams, we take this bad habit of poor defending to the games against the top teams and we lose. Defending is in the mind, you need to practice and form a regimental mentality and discipline. Sadly, we lack this important facet of the game and it is threatening to undermine another season.

My view is Wenger has to take a more pragmatic approach, I think Wenger should be a bit wiser with tactics. Playing away to Chelsea with the lazy and at times wasteful and unpredictable Arshavin plus the lazy Nasri is asking for trouble. We were punished for Nasri's laziness when he lazily allowed Cole in for the first goal. For example, you will not see Chelsea or Man Utd play two defensively weak wide players when they play, Chelsea, Arsenal, Man City etc. Man Utd when they play us will bring in Park for obvious reasons. Even when they are forced to play weak wide players, they compromised by putting a defensive work horse in some other parts of the pitch.

We must compromise and Wenger must take a pick of one, he cannot play both Nasri and Arshavin in such games. It's why all Gooners have been begging for a nonsense DM for years, one thing to have box-box CM when said CM is Patrick Vieira but entirely something else when it's Alex Song.

We lost yesterday's game because of our poor defending as a team, the stats bear this out. We also gave away the ball 14 times in our half to Chelsea's 7 times. The second goal came from us carelessly giving the ball away in our own half.
 

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How can that article say "we didn't defend well" and in the same mention say, "Drogba scored a goal that no other striker will score?"

I thought the defense actually did a nice job in and of itself, but they were left out to dry by the midfield on too many occasions.
As Tunis said defend as a team not just looking at the back four.

Don't forget Chelsea had other very good opportunities to increase the lead. Anelka should have scored, Ramires clear on goal on his own given wrongly offside plus a string of Fabianski saves, well the ball just hit him most times.

The team are on course to ship far too many goals again this season in the league.

The Alsace King has to find a solution to this or no more big trophies for him or the club in his next four years.
 

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Thank You Arsene for all the wonderful year of pure enjoyment watching Arsenal play.
 

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As Tunis said defend as a team not just looking at the back four.

Don't forget Chelsea had other very good opportunities to increase the lead. Anelka should have scored, Ramires clear on goal on his own given wrongly offside plus a string of Fabianski saves, well the ball just hit him most times.

The team are on course to ship far too many goals again this season in the league.

The Alsace King has to find a solution to this or no more big trophies for him or the club in his next four years.
The Anelka thing I'm also inclined to see as a one-off until Squillaci does it again. Interesting that you pinpoint the Ramires chance, guilty culprit again was Clichy, it's amazing how crap he's become in the space of just 2 years, completely indefensible and I like him.

I still just have a problem with crying doom and gloom because we lost to Chelsea at their ground no less.

I do agree about defending as a team though, the luxury players like Arsha I can somewhat understand (Anelka and Malouda aren't doing much defending for Chelsea), but Song's error was absolutely inexcusable from a player who's on the pitch to prevent the other team from scoring goals.

As you and others have constantly pointed out, I'm not even sure that it's just about talent. It's about mentality. This lot constantly try to play the ball out from the back and though they've been burned on it many times, they just keep trying. It's stuff like that. Song losing the ball, Clichy not staying tight on Anelka, etc. Until it's absolutely drilled into them, there will always be the mistakes, look at Clichy trying to play out in the 94th minute instead of hoofing it and costing us 2 points.

Be nice to have a specialized defensive coach like they do in basketball and let Wenger handle the attack.
 

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Well as mentioned, it all comes down to tactics, and we definitely need a defensive coach brought in, and/or a super centre back.
 

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I don't think the club is geared towards being overly successful on the field, so I can't say that i'm overly disappointed with the performance of the team on the pitch. I'm not even particularly disappointed with the lack of motivation from the club for victory, due to the boards financially based viewpoint of achieving success. When you look at the scale of the debts that clubs like Man Utd are in, and Liverpool, it is horrendous. Of course Arsenal has a significant debt also, one though which seems to be in a continual process of erosion as the stadium pays for itself. We have a beautiful stadium to show for our financial consternation, more then can be said for most other clubs. Arsenal has accepted a financial prudency, which is shared by clubs in Germany, and is now beginning to be shared by teams throughout the continent. A win at all costs philosphy is not on the cards, particularly as it would only lead to terminal decline when competing against the financial power of the oil fuelled Chelsea and Man City.

Arsene has complied fully with the remit that was given him, and although many would point to the lack of making key purchases in key areas of the pitch, this may be due to financial constraints, as well as the underlying ethos that guides the club now. Bring young players through, who's play has been indelibly marked by the Wenger system, and cement with quality players bought for reasonable amounts. Arsenal in this era will never be able to compete with Man City, Chelsea, or Manure. If we achieve fourth place that should be satisfactory, in this new found realsim of world football.
 

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I don't think the club is geared towards being overly successful on the field, so I can't say that i'm overly disappointed with the performance of the team on the pitch. I'm not even particularly disappointed with the lack of motivation from the club for victory, due to the boards financially based viewpoint of achieving success. When you look at the scale of the debts that clubs like Man Utd are in, and Liverpool, it is horrendous. Of course Arsenal has a significant debt also, one though which seems to be in a continual process of erosion as the stadium pays for itself. We have a beautiful stadium to show for our financial consternation, more then can be said for most other clubs. Arsenal has accepted a financial prudency, which is shared by clubs in Germany, and is now beginning to be shared by teams throughout the continent. A win at all costs philosphy is not on the cards, particularly as it would only lead to terminal decline when competing against the financial power of the oil fuelled Chelsea and Man City.

Arsene has complied fully with the remit that was given him, and although many would point to the lack of making key purchases in key areas of the pitch, this may be due to financial constraints, as well as the underlying ethos that guides the club now. Bring young players through, who's play has been indelibly marked by the Wenger system, and cement with quality players bought for reasonable amounts. Arsenal in this era will never be able to compete with Man City, Chelsea, or Manure. If we achieve fourth place that should be satisfactory, in this new found realsim of world football.
As whole AW and the board have done an outstanding job taking Arsenal to another plateau.

Still not a justification for our GK situation nor how inept Arsenal have been for years defensively. Think the lack of fuinds is a factor but not the end all and be all. A managers manager job is to instill a structured, discipled side defensively and a winners mentality, AW simply has not been able to do that for quite sometime.
 

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As whole AW and the board have done an outstanding job taking Arsenal to another plateau.

Still not a justification for our GK situation nor how inept Arsenal have been for years defensively. Think the lack of fuinds is a factor but not the end all and be all. A managers manager job is to instill a structured, discipled side defensively and a winners mentality, AW simply has not been able to do that for quite sometime.
I think a managers job is to achieved the greatest performance possible from a team, with budgetary considerations a large factor. Wenger has instilled the team with an attacking ethos, an attacking ethos that has served the team very well over the years, and brought many plaudits. As a consequence, of the attacking nature of the teams play, the defence is going to be disregarded to a certain extent. All parts of the system, has an influence on all other parts. If we were more conservative in midfield, would the defence be put under the pressure it often is? If we did not keep the ball as we do, and played it longer, we would have fewer players out of position, on occasions when we lose the ball. It is too simple to say, that we should have a disciplined defence quality, when in reality such a characteristic, would probably be to the negation of our very style of play.

Should the team then, change it's style of play to say that of Chelsea? Possibly, but given the financial constraints, this would be probably a transformation into being Aston Villa, more then something more desirable for attainment. I think personally that the defence can and should be improved, but we will never be a particularly good side defensively, whilst we are unable to afford better personale. My biggest gripe with the defence, isn't from a defensive point of view, it is from an offensive one. I believe with how narrowly we play, we could do with alot more offense coming from our flanks. Clichy and Sagna, are part of the reason our attack is often not as expressive as it could be.

Regarding the keeper situation, I expect it's alot less simply then buying a top class keeper. Who for instance is available for the budget we have, the club allocated less then 4m in the pursuance of Schwarzer, hardly a substantial warchest. Perhaps this was Wengers decision, I expect the board had more then a little influence however. Keepers are hard to come by these days, just look at how old the keepers for Man Utd and Valencia are. We need a new keeper yes, but as Hill Wood is keen to say, money doesn't grow on trees.
 

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I just keep thinking about the hard work and pressure which yielded great results early last season but they gave it up and it's not applied consistently, here we are talking about laziness from this player, and that player. It started, for example the 2-0 win away in Glasgow, it wasn't a brilliant display but they took it well thanks to hard work. They started it, why couldn't Wenger persist with it, tell them to continue down that path? These frustrating details missed.
 

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Great posts Redpig. :thumbsup:
Full backs today see so much of the ball in attacking areas it ridiculous, the majority do so little with it. Dani Alves meant to be one of the best but against Inter last year he was so frustrating, just kept crossing the ball in the air trying to pick out one of the seven dwarfs, much like we do. Why i'd prefer Eboue and Gibbs in the team over the usual two because they may occasionally do something else.
 

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Why i'd prefer Eboue and Gibbs in the team over the usual two because they may occasionally do something else.
I'd like to see Gibbs and Sagna, personally. Eboué is better than Sagna offensively, but considerably weaker from a defensive standpoint.

Sagna can deliver the odd good cross aswell.

EDIT: I should add; Sagna isn't on form, currently, so it could be the right moment to play Eboué.

Then again, Clichy, Song et al also deserve to be dropped right now.
 

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is it only me more worried about our attacking against top sides than our defending, when we had Henry and Bergkamp we never used to care if Chelsea could get a couple, as we'd just get three or four, while RvP, Theo and all our other dangerous attackers are so injury prone we need to bring in heavy hitters not someone like Chamakh who is decent but won't ever blow a defence away?
 

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is it only me more worried about our attacking against top sides than our defending, when we had Henry and Bergkamp we never used to care if Chelsea could get a couple, as we'd just get three or four, while RvP, Theo and all our other dangerous attackers are so injury prone we need to bring in heavy hitters not someone like Chamakh who is decent but won't ever blow a defence away?
WELCOME BACK JERN

:thumbsup::thumbsup::thumbsup:

Back in the Henry, DB 10 era the games against Man Utd were tight games. Games usually came down to the battles in the trenches between the likes of Keane and PV4.

Biggest wins against Man Utd were one nil to Arsenal i.e 98 Overmars and 2002 Wiltord. In 2002 we won it sans Henry, DB 10 and Super Bob. Thing is if we could keep clean sheets the worse Arsenal could do against the likes of Chelsea and Man Utd would be 0-0 draws which would ensure valuable points.
 
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