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What is an acceptable result for Euro 2008?

EURO08- what is an acceptable result for the tournament?

4324 Views 111 Replies 38 Participants Last post by  Rupa
For you what is acceptable?

Can we have a poll mods.

1-I will accept nothing less then winning the whole thing
2-I will except nothing less then semis
3-I will accept nothing less the quaters
4-I will accept nothing less then getting out of the group stage
5-I will accept anything
6-Other, please explain
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I change my vote...I'll accept anything. We Croats are tactically clueless and that's putting it nicely. We rely on individual talent that at times comes together to form a true team.
I'm not sure I follow what you mean by "tactically clueless". I'd be shocked if you're suggesting we play without tactics. But assuming you're not, what aspect of our tactics is so bad that it's regarded as clueless?

For the record I happen to think that Bilic is tactically very solid and superior to any previous NT coach.
I'm not sure I follow what you mean by "tactically clueless". I'd be shocked if you're suggesting we play without tactics. But assuming you're not, what aspect of our tactics is so bad that it's regarded as clueless?

For the record I happen to think that Bilic is tactically very solid and superior to any previous NT coach.
I dont thinik he was saying that either. One of the main reasons to watch this collection is that technically they are all there. No pass is made without the utmost thought. Nothing is wasted.

Now man-marking is a totally different story.
For the record I happen to think that Bilic is tactically very solid and superior to any previous NT coach.
I agree. :thmbup:
yeah, but when Croatia get knocked out in the group stages he will go down the same as the previous managers, and we will bring in Ivankovic, who will qualify and get sacked after World Cup 2010, then we will hire Zoran Vulic, who will qualify but get sacked after Euro 2012, the cycle will never stop when I'm alive :D
I'm not sure I follow what you mean by "tactically clueless". I'd be shocked if you're suggesting we play without tactics. But assuming you're not, what aspect of our tactics is so bad that it's regarded as clueless?

For the record I happen to think that Bilic is tactically very solid and superior to any previous NT coach.
Even over Ivic?

Cheersch
actually if we would have played an extra defender instead of Olic, that guy would have scored more goal than him and we would have conceded less goals !

LMAO!!!

PAHAHAHA!!!

I agree wholeheartedly.

Cheersch
Even over Ivic?

Cheersch
Obviously Bilic can't compete with Ivic at club level. However, nor can Ivic compare with Bilic at NT level mainly because Ivic only coached the NT for the game against Italy.
I dont thinik he was saying that either. One of the main reasons to watch this collection is that technically they are all there. No pass is made without the utmost thought. Nothing is wasted.

Now man-marking is a totally different story.
No, no, our 67 year-old man markers will come good, they just need to get some games into their legs...:party:
I was drunk and angry when I posted :D

That being said, I believe that all of our coaches pick a format/tactic that suits them and then they try to make players fit into that as best they can.

LB has been a problem for the whole qualifying campaign and it took until this friendly for Bilic to attempt something new. Why was Pranjic not tried sooner so that he could properly adjust to the role? Why was Corluka never tried? Or Srna? Srna has played LB for Shakhtar in the past when needed. We had three options and instead he put a CB there.

Then there's the issue of Srna and where he's best suited. Why not at least try him out at RB and see if the team performs better that way?

Now we have the Eduardo injury and he throws two non-box strikers in a 4-4-2 and wonders why it didn't work out? Why is he wondering? I think Orkan mentioned in another thread how Olic has excelled at Hamburg because of the 3 striker formation they use. Why was this not even attempted as a possible answer to losing Eduardo. No, instead it was just the same formation and make it fit.

Whether it's Bilic, Kranjcar or Baric, they all did similar things. This is a problem in our game and it needs to change.

The biggest concern is that these things were never even attempted.
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I was drunk and angry when I posted :D

That being said, I believe that all of our coaches pick a format/tactic that suits them and then they try to make players fit into that as best they can.

LB has been a problem for the whole qualifying campaign and it took until this friendly for Bilic to attempt something new. Why was Pranjic not tried sooner so that he could properly adjust to the role? Why was Corluka never tried? Or Srna? Srna has played LB for Shakhtar in the past when needed. We had three options and instead he put a CB there.

Then there's the issue of Srna and where he's best suited. Why not at least try him out at RB and see if the team performs better that way?

Now we have the Eduardo injury and he throws two non-box strikers in a 4-4-2 and wonders why it didn't work out? Why is he wondering? I think Orkan mentioned in another thread how Olic has excelled at Hamburg because of the 3 striker formation they use. Why was this not even attempted as a possible answer to losing Eduardo. No, instead it was just the same formation and make it fit.

Whether it's Bilic, Kranjcar or Baric, they all did similar things. This is a problem in our game and it needs to change.

The biggest concern is that these things were never even attempted.

were u drunk again when u posted this?:smileani:

i think u make some good points though about how our coaches dont try different formations enough espicially in friendlies where u should experiment..bilic finally tried pranjic at leftback but he should have been playing there a long time ago as he has always performed well at his club..we only have 2 friendles left so who knows if bilic will change anything with only 2 games to prepare..
I was drunk and angry when I posted :D
:howler:. I think there's been instances when even courts of law have found that murder was excusable when someone was drunk and angry :)

That being said, I believe that all of our coaches pick a format/tactic that suits them and then they try to make players fit into that as best they can.
I think that's the case with a lot of coaches, not just ours. In a way it's natural that we all have our own conceptions about what constitutes good football 'style' wise. Pro coaches are no different, but I think the really good ones tend to show a fair bit of flexibility.

LB has been a problem for the whole qualifying campaign and it took until this friendly for Bilic to attempt something new. Why was Pranjic not tried sooner so that he could properly adjust to the role? Why was Corluka never tried? Or Srna? Srna has played LB for Shakhtar in the past when needed. We had three options and instead he put a CB there.

Then there's the issue of Srna and where he's best suited. Why not at least try him out at RB and see if the team performs better that way?

Now we have the Eduardo injury and he throws two non-box strikers in a 4-4-2 and wonders why it didn't work out? Why is he wondering? I think Orkan mentioned in another thread how Olic has excelled at Hamburg because of the 3 striker formation they use. Why was this not even attempted as a possible answer to losing Eduardo. No, instead it was just the same formation and make it fit.

Whether it's Bilic, Kranjcar or Baric, they all did similar things. This is a problem in our game and it needs to change.

The biggest concern is that these things were never even attempted.
I think the NT is reaching a point where change in personnel is starting to come about mainly because our prospects are improving and our old guard is dropping off. That wasn't the case during the qualifiers when we were winning and winning well. I think it would've been a problem if Bilic tinkered too much during the qualifiers. Both our wings were working, we were scoring goals and for the most part our defence was working.

These days however things look like they're changing and already we're seeing Bilic pushing through change (ironically the same changes that many here were calling for which should give some measure of comfort). Pranjic has been included, Simic dropped and Vukojevic, Knezevic and Budan all given realistic expectations. Everybody knows positions are up for grabs.

Bilic still has two friendlies and then he gets three weeks alone with the boys. That's where he'll get his chance to further show his stuff as a coach. Interestingly it was during that same phase that Cico fell to bits. I somehow doubt Bilic will.
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the couple of weeks before the tournament to me will be the most important.

Yes we know we can play, but will we be fit?

I think that should be 70% of the preparation for the tournament
:howler:. I think there's been instances when even courts of law have found that murder was excusable when someone was drunk and angry :)



I think that's the case with a lot of coaches, not just ours. In a way it's natural that we all have our own conceptions about what constitutes good football 'style' wise. Pro coaches are no different, but I think the really good ones tend to show a fair bit of flexibility.



I think the NT is reaching a point where change in personnel is starting to come about mainly because our prospects are improving and our old guard is dropping off. That wasn't the case during the qualifiers when we were winning and winning well. I think it would've been a problem if Bilic tinkered too much during the qualifiers. Both our wings were working, we were scoring goals and for the most part our defence was working.

These days however things look like they're changing and already we're seeing Bilic pushing through change (ironically the same changes that many here were calling for which should give some measure of comfort). Pranjic has been included, Simic dropped and Vukojevic, Knezevic and Budan all given realistic expectations. Everybody knows positions are up for grabs.


Bilic still has two friendlies and then he gets three weeks alone with the boys. That's where he'll get his chance to further show his stuff as a coach. Interestingly it was during that same phase that Cico fell to bits. I somehow doubt Bilic will.
Great post!
Sulla said:
I think the NT is reaching a point where change in personnel is starting to come about mainly because our prospects are improving and our old guard is dropping off.
This was always going to happen (much) sooner than later. We find ourselves now in the situation of having to make adjustments to crucial areas of the team at the worst possible time. A bit of foresight and all of this could have been avoided.

That wasn't the case during the qualifiers when we were winning and winning well. I think it would've been a problem if Bilic tinkered too much during the qualifiers. Both our wings were working, we were scoring goals and for the most part our defence was working.
I disagree. I think, barring a couple of matches, our defence struggled in this campaign (inc. friendlies). Our right flank was probably our strongest point at one stage in the campaign but our left wing was always a concern. Krunchie's form fluctuated and he really hit a low with the NT towards the end there (notwithstanding his strike against the English). We did score goals but were also kept scoreless by the Russians twice, had a monumental struggle against the Macedonians (in both matches) and managed to beat the Estonians (away) and Israelis (home) by solitary goal margins. If you take away the two Andorra games it makes up for a bulk of the qual. games.

These days however things look like they're changing and already we're seeing Bilic pushing through change (ironically the same changes that many here were calling for which should give some measure of comfort). Pranjic has been included, Simic dropped and Vukojevic, Knezevic and Budan all given realistic expectations. Everybody knows positions are up for grabs.
Slaven's comments after the game suggest otherwise. Yes, the striker's position is up for grabs and Pranjić still needs to secure the LB position but these issues aren't the most pressing.

The only changes that have happened, as I see it, is that Vukojević has replaced Leko as the no.2 DM, that Knežević is now ahead of Šimić (but still behind Šimunić). It's not good enough that we have these guys still not in the XI 3 months out from the opening match. How much more proof do we need that Robi is finished? Does he need to cost us the three points against Austria before we say enough is enough?

Bilic still has two friendlies and then he gets three weeks alone with the boys. That's where he'll get his chance to further show his stuff as a coach. Interestingly it was during that same phase that Cico fell to bits. I somehow doubt Bilic will.
Apart from physical and psychological preparation, nothing in terms of the XI will come out of those three weeks. When grading Slaven's performance the immediate weeks before the tournament fall into a separate category IMO. By then, if changes will be made he has to already have made them.
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Robert Kovac is done.

Niko Kovac is done.

I dont know why people are excluding Simunic from the 11. He has hardly had a chance as a CB under Bilic. I would still take Joey over Knezevic.

I hope Slaven doesnt put Niko Kovac and Robert Kovacs feelings and pride ahead of the greater good which is what is right and the best for Croatia at Euro 08...I think we will all know what he is thinking from these next 2 friendlies.

And to me, it might seem late for all these changes, yes, BUT! if he did go with Vukjevic, Pranjic & Corluka and Simunic as CBs, nobody would be able to read us. Theyd have nothing and i dont think it would be some long period of time for the guys to adjust to each other.

In fact i think it would be great.
And to me, it might seem late for all these changes, yes, BUT! if he did go with Vukjevic, Pranjic & Corluka and Simunic as CBs, nobody would be able to read us. Theyd have nothing and i dont think it would be some long period of time for the guys to adjust to each other.
It's never late to make the right change but what happens now is that most likely we will not be doing it on our own terms. These guys will not be given the best possible opportunity to gel (speaking hypothetically because these changes will not be made) because you need to do it as far away from the spotlight as possible and ideally with as much preparation as possible. For example, if Knežević comes in it will most likely be as a replacement for an out of form Robert Kovač. Instead of doing this in a qualifying game against Estonia at home in what is essentially a safe encounter we are doing it against Germany in a cut throat clash at Euro 2008. He may come through with flying colours but he could just as easily crumble (remember Tomas at WC2006).

ps. it's always more dangerous to go into a game with an untried defensive unit than it is with the midfield or attack. These positions require a great understanding between the players and at the highest level any mistake will be punished (just like the Dutch punished our sloppiness in Split).
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Well i wouldnt put Knezevic in right now.

I would go with this

Srna-Corluka-Simunic-Pranjic. 3 of those guys know those postions like the back of their hands
Ćevapčići kid;6221546 said:
Well i wouldnt put Knezevic in right now.

I would go with this

Srna-Corluka-Simunic-Pranjic. 3 of those guys know those postions like the back of their hands
I used him purely as an example. :thumbsup:
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