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First impression: that sounds like a stretch. But the decision to go by "training form" only - non-negotiable - is so batshit insane that it could well be the actual reason.

Whatever it is, Grealish's statement along with Southgate's own admission that training form was the one and only factor makes me reverse my earlier sympathy for Southgate here. This was nuts. Absolutely NUTS. But he'd still have nothing on that Economist article. I still can't process how infinitely moronic that is, lol.
I don't get the training form argument? Are they saying that they practiced penalties and selected the five that had the best average?

Otherwise I'm talking about the criticism from Linekar and Keane, amongst others who suggested that Grealish didnt step up, leaving the last two takers to have to take them.


I do think there was a bit of virtue signaling by Southgate if what Grealish says is true. You always go with the guys who, in that moment, feel it and want it.
 

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LOL, what a weird article.

How is Grealish throwing Southgate under the bus by setting the record straight and calling Keane out for talking bullshit?

Keane: 'Grealish is a weak little bitch who won't step up to take a penalty' :mad:
Grealish: 'Erhm, no, I actually wanted to take a penalty' :rolleyes:
Weirdos on twitter: 'OMG, Grealish like totally threw Southgate under the bus' :eek:

Media: *Damn, this is a story worth reporting 🥴
 

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Southgate
I've been meaning to ask, what happened in the South? I've heard of Watergate, Gamergate, Russiagate... but what the heck is Southgate?
 

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I don't get the training form argument? Are they saying that they practiced penalties and selected the five that had the best average?
Yes, that's what Southgate confirmed....and it makes zero sense. If your striker does a Martin Palermo in 90 mins, Southgate says "yeah, but training form" and puts him down for the shootout. It's unheard of.
 

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Yes, that's what Southgate confirmed....and it makes zero sense. If your striker does a Martin Palermo in 90 mins, Southgate says "yeah, but training form" and puts him down for the shootout. It's unheard of.
unheard of? that's how all my teams used to do it growing up lol
 

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Anyway England is engaging in typical loser mentality. They should just take the L and recognize they are much better and more respectable than they used to be. That is huge for them and should already start looking forward to 2022, rather than racism, penalty kicks and so on...

It's a privilege to be beaten by a 4-star team in the final ;) #ItCameRome
 

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It was a CRUSHING defeat for them. They were at home with a full stadium allowed for the first time in more than a year, celebrating a win before the the match and got an early goal. What did they do? Play 10 players behind the ball until we scored, a poor man's version of catennacio, the thing they used to hate for years. They blew it, and may never get to a final again.
 

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Yes, that's what Southgate confirmed....and it makes zero sense. If your striker does a Martin Palermo in 90 mins, Southgate says "yeah, but training form" and puts him down for the shootout. It's unheard of.
Practicing penalties in low pressure environments (practice) and trying to say that it's scientific is the lowest quality science you can lean on because it misses the biggest variable: PRESSURE of course.

So, fine, I have no problem with teams having fun practicing penalties at the end of practice. I do that with my teams all the time, for fun. You get a good idea who has better accuracy etc, but when it comes to a competitive situation you look into the eyes of each player and say "who wants it?" And select from there.

I'm glad Southgate "trusted the science" or whatever he says he did. It made sure they didn't steal the game!
 

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It was a CRUSHING defeat for them. They were at home with a full stadium allowed for the first time in more than a year, celebrating a win before the the match and got an early goal. What did they do? Play 10 players behind the ball until we scored, a poor man's version of catennacio, the thing they used to hate for years. They blew it, and may never get to a final again.
English fans getting on Southgate is interesting. What were they expecting him to do, open up and it be over in 90. England got a very nice quick goal. I was oddly calm at that point. I told my daughter that they'd press for another 20, then run out of ideas and we'd take over. That's pretty much what happened. At that point do you keep going forward when we were pressing them and only needed a bit more space for Chiesa or Barella, Insigne to run through? Southgate got them to penalties because had 8 players in their box almost at all times. He did well. :)
 

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It's not like Italy created any chances though. Showed a lot of determination at a set piece and got the equalizer.

It was like other boring finals, 2006, 1994...
 

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Some here sound like Italy had it in the bag. Though Italy had more possession, I don't even remember a single clear chance from open play. England was defending well, Italian players were getting quite frustrated and exasperated, and we scored on a set piece. Reminds me more of the WC 2006 final than anything really...

The front 3 was what it was. Immobile never touched the ball, Insigne didn't have the speed or quality to go past Walker once and Chiesa was isolated. Despite having only two mids vs three in the center, Decclan Rice especially was winning a lot of loose balls.

In the end, England, like Italy, didn't have the quality to score another goal from open play against a well organized side, and it went to penalties...
 

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Discussion Starter · #234 ·
No Way. In 2006 I was very close to heart infarction and I was 35 yo. After Buffon saved a header of Zidane I had to go out on the balcony and relax.
Fifteen years later I might risk heart infarction for many reasons but England.
 

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Some here sound like Italy had it in the bag. Though Italy had more possession, I don't even remember a single clear chance from open play. England was defending well, Italian players were getting quite frustrated and exasperated, and we scored on a set piece. Reminds me more of the WC 2006 final than anything really...

The front 3 was what it was. Immobile never touched the ball, Insigne didn't have the speed or quality to go past Walker once and Chiesa was isolated. Despite having only two mids vs three in the center, Decclan Rice especially was winning a lot of loose balls.

In the end, England, like Italy, didn't have the quality to score another goal from open play against a well organized side, and it went to penalties...

Pickfords save on Chiesa's right footed drive going towards Pickfords left was by far the best opportunity. Very good save by Pickford there. That was going in (3:37 of the video). Insigne from a very tight angle a little earlier on, not as certain a goal but was on net nonetheless (3:11 of video). Berardi over the top after getting behind the defense (4:45). Also not a goal as he didn't hit particularly well. Incidentally the second of that type for him. He hit the target in an earlier game albeit offside. Chiesa had another drive that was marginally wide in the first but had Pickford frozen (1:23 of the video). Chiesa did really well to stay on his feet on that play too. On two occasions he could have gone down, Sterling might have opted to in his shoes. Italy had 6 shots on target to Englands 1.

More importantly, what stands out most to me is having 8 men in the box at almost all times worked well for the country that used to say it was cowardly, when it wasn't even nearly as exclusively defensive.

I'm enjoying that for sure.

It's also not really a stretch to suggest that had England not have been so exclusively defensive, more than 6 opportunities would have presented with as hard as Italy were going at them. I think it would have been resolved in 90 based on the run of play.

And on a different note Verratti is often criticized for not getting forward often enough even though the bulk of his work is done maintaining the midfield shape and keeping possession of the ball which is half the battle, but the little guy got a nice header on the ball that Pickford pushed off of the post on Leo's goal. I think Verratti's contribution to this game went a little unnoticed.

What do you guys think?
 

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Verratti?

 
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