Xtratime Community banner

1 - 20 of 41 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
22,487 Posts
Discussion Starter #1
Two dutch teams in the semi-finals of the european competitions this season. Okay, a little bit of luck inclusive, but in my opinion AZ and PSV deserve this, because they showed good performances over the whole season. Great for the dutch league, for the dutch football. I am sure not many people in Spain, Italy or England haven´t heard about AZ before this season, dutch league normally means Ajax, PSV and Feyenoord for them all. And most of the football fans in other countries do not really care about the Eredivisie.
In my opinion the league is underrated, what do you think?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
22,800 Posts
I don't know. If we would make a list of the european leagues it would look like this:

1. Spain
2. Italy
3. England
4. Germany
5. France

Holland belongs below those. Somewhere along the level of Portugal i suppose. Greece has a decent league also but i like to believe ours is better.
I have no idea how others rate us though.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
259 Posts
Dutch people rate our league correctly I think. We know we can`t compete with the topleagues. We are better than Scotland, Turkey and Greece, but same level as POrtugal and just below France. Abroad they don`t take us seriously especially from the bigger leagues, and rightfully so. no reason a Italian, Spamniard or ENglish guy should be impressed by us. And what a guy from a smaller league like ours thinks, well who cares. ;)
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
4,073 Posts
Holland will never have a great league again.
But Ajax, PSV and Feyenoord are of course great clubs.
AZ suprised us all this season but what if they lose their best players?
Vitesse a few years ago was considered the 4th club but look what happened.

It's mid-class and perfect for players who wants to develop themselves.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
10,421 Posts
Sfertje said:
Dutch people rate our league correctly I think. We know we can`t compete with the topleagues. We are better than Scotland, Turkey and Greece, but same level as POrtugal and just below France. Abroad they don`t take us seriously especially from the bigger leagues, and rightfully so. no reason a Italian, Spamniard or ENglish guy should be impressed by us. And what a guy from a smaller league like ours thinks, well who cares. ;)
We are above the Portuguese league as well imo. Ajax, PSV and Feyenoord, equal Porto, Sporting and Benfica. Then in Portugal you have Boavista and maybe Braga, but then there is a huge gap with the rest of the league. In Holland, you have AZ, Utrecht, Vitesse, Twente and Heerenveen who are all reasonably big clubs, with large crowds and good squads.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
10,421 Posts
Also, most players in the eredivisie are technically and tactically superiour to most EPL players for instance. That's one thing.

Another thing is that our stadiums are always full, something we cannot say in Italy for instance.

And thirdly, the attractive play. 4-3-3 is still widely used by most Eredivisie sides, while everybody can defeat everybody, so in terms of attraction, it is a very nice league to watch.

If we put all these things together, we have a very interesting league, which is underrated by most Dutch people imo. Het gras bij de buren...
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
259 Posts
I agree on the entertainment part, although most foreigners who have follwoed PSV won`t agree with us anymore. ;)

Its most attractive, it also hosts many young players and indeed is reasonable competitive, although that doesn`t go normally for Ajax and PSV.

Comparison to Portugese league is reasonable, but I think the Portogese top is better than the Dutch right now. PSV advanced also thanks to an easy first round, and Feyenoord got played of the field twice by Sporting. I don`t really consider Feyenoord part of the top 3, I see them more as the number 3. They can have a surprise season every now and again, but are on distance of Ajax and PSV. AZ is up and coming but not yet arrived, while Porto, Sporting and Benfica are good quality teams, with football in them as well. So I feel it is a bit 50/50 between the leagues. I don`t see the midtable teams of Portugal playthough, so maybe they are really much worse than in Holland.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
10,421 Posts
Sfertje said:
I don`t really consider Feyenoord part of the top 3, I see them more as the number 3.
That's signature material man :proud:

:pp
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
259 Posts
Best thing is I said it purely out of opinion, not to diss Feyenoorsd fans. Thats just bonus. :D
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
59,308 Posts
Prince-O said:
That's signature material man :proud:

:pp
ah shaddup, you first concentrate on your avatar :finger: :D

agree pretty much with what you say. We're probably the 5th or 7th best league in Europe and we'll never be higher unless 10 Abrahamovics come into Dutch football. One thing where we are head and shoulders above England is when it comes to managers.

English managers are awful in general. Tactically they are naive and it says a lot that none of the top sides have an English manager in charge, let alone their NT. Even the Scots have better managers and that says a lot. The best English managers supposedly now are longball & setpiece Alleydice, 10 men behind the ball Curbishley and the man who still can't finish above Spurs despite having 10s of millions to spend, Steve MacClaren. That says a lot and for a great footballing nation like England, it's poor.
Sfertje said:
Comparison to Portugese league is reasonable, but I think the Portogese top is better than the Dutch right now. PSV advanced also thanks to an easy first round, and Feyenoord got played of the field twice by Sporting.
If you include Feyenoord and Ajax then I'd agree though as they've been awful for large parts of the season but there is no way PSV would lose to this seasons Porto who are a shadow of last years team or Benfica who lost 3-0 to Anderlecht of all teams in the CL qualifiers!!!, 3-0 to Stuttgart and who only beat Heerenveen in the last 10 minutes at home thanks to smerige counters. You might say then what are Benfica doing on top of the league but if you look at their head to head results with the top sides this season, Sporting and Porto, they've failed to beat them and even lost to them. The main reason why they're top is cos Sporting have often dropped points against the minnows in the Portuguese league after their outing in the UEFA cup (like Feyenoord when they won the UEFA cup, they're suffering in the league thanks to this).

Also I don't think you're giving PSV enough credit or recognition. Out of the top of my head, the 2 groups of their last 2 opponents:

Lyon
Man U
Fenerbahce
Sparta Prague

Lyon would have been tight but Man U are definitely a beatable side for this seasons PSV imho. THeir midfield isn't what it was and a defence with Silvestre and the likes is not top class. Fenerbahce and Sparta Prague would have been no match for PSV thanks to their for CL standard, leaky defences.

Monaco
Liverpool
Olympiakos
Deportivo

Against Monaco, we all saw what PSV did. Olympiakos would have been beaten too by PSV, at least in Eindhoven and the fact that Olympiakos got booted out the UEFA cup by Newcastle 6-1 on aggregate! who are having their worst season in a long time speaks volumes. Deportivo were just shocking in this years CL. Only Liverpool would have been hard, not cos they're an amazing side but mainly cos of their manager ala PSV .
Here again PSV would have comfortably qualified. Only from Milan/Barcas group, they'd have found it hard to qualify but from the others, even Ajaxs, PSV certainly would have been a match to Bayern and Juve from what I seen.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
28 Posts
I don't know about which one between the Portuguese and the Dutch is better, I think they're both pretty equal with the difference that midtable/bottom Eredivisie sides are beaten in a much easier way by the big ones than in Portugal where usually there are a lot of upsets. I think that the midtable teams in Portugal are more tactically aware and have better defences, while in Holland there is slightly better quality in the attack/midfield but the defences are really naive in my opinion.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
22,487 Posts
Discussion Starter #12
Stygmata said:
1. Spain
2. Italy
3. England
4. Germany
5. France
My list would be:

1. Italy
2. Spain
3. England
4. Germany

But I wouldn´t say that the french league is better than the dutch. At least the Top 4 of the dutch league would be able to beat every team of the League 1. And there is also much cr** in the french league.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
259 Posts
Wally said:
ah shaddup, you first concentrate on your avatar :finger: :D
If you include Feyenoord and Ajax then I'd agree though as they've been awful for large parts of the season but there is no way PSV would lose to this seasons Porto who are a shadow of last years team or Benfica who lost 3-0 to Anderlecht of all teams in the CL qualifiers!!!, 3-0 to Stuttgart and who only beat Heerenveen in the last 10 minutes at home thanks to smerige counters. You might say then what are Benfica doing on top of the league but if you look at their head to head results with the top sides this season, Sporting and Porto, they've failed to beat them and even lost to them. The main reason why they're top is cos Sporting have often dropped points against the minnows in the Portuguese league after their outing in the UEFA cup (like Feyenoord when they won the UEFA cup, they're suffering in the league thanks to this).
PSV this season is really strong, and Porto is coping, or trying to, with a clear out sale from last season, but they will bounce back. This season PSV is stronger, but Ajax and Feyenoord would loose to Porto, and most definetly to Sporting as well. Since Benfica is number 1 in the Portugese league, they must be pretty decent too. They might have lost to other big rivals, but earnnig so much points against lesser teams is also a sign of a topteam. That they loose to Sporting and Porto doesn`t mean they would also loose to Dutch top 3 teams.

Also I don't think you're giving PSV enough credit or recognition. Out of the top of my head, the 2 groups of their last 2 opponents:

Lyon
Man U
Fenerbahce
Sparta Prague

Lyon would have been tight but Man U are definitely a beatable side for this seasons PSV imho. THeir midfield isn't what it was and a defence with Silvestre and the likes is not top class. Fenerbahce and Sparta Prague would have been no match for PSV thanks to their for CL standard, leaky defences.
Man Utd is good, and Lyon is ok, other two are decent. Man Utd though has a very good forward line. I hate Rooney but he is really hard to stop. And the defence of Man Utd isn`t as bad anymore as when Rio had his suspension. His comeback made it better. PSV would have a small chance, but Man Utd would be favourites.

Monaco
Liverpool
Olympiakos
Deportivo

Against Monaco, we all saw what PSV did. Olympiakos would have been beaten too by PSV, at least in Eindhoven and the fact that Olympiakos got booted out the UEFA cup by Newcastle 6-1 on aggregate! who are having their worst season in a long time speaks volumes. Deportivo were just shocking in this years CL. Only Liverpool would have been hard, not cos they're an amazing side but mainly cos of their manager ala PSV .
Here again PSV would have comfortably qualified. Only from Milan/Barcas group, they'd have found it hard to qualify but from the others, even Ajaxs, PSV certainly would have been a match to Bayern and Juve from what I seen.
Olympiakos and Depor aren`t that good, Liverpool is doing ok in Europe I guess but don`t play good football in the league. Monaco itself is mediocre at best. In Ajax group PSV would have been out for sure, just like us.

I don`t see where all the positivism is comnig from regarding PSV. They haven`t beaten a good team yet in the CL this year. Monaco is hardly a good team, and in the poule Arsenal was to good and they got the points against weak sides like Rosenborg and Panathinaikos. Lyon was a big disappointment to me and PSV couldn`t beat them either. Now they meet their first really good opponent, we will see what they can do. I think PSV is good in the game they play, but it will never get them past teams which are experienced and mature in football, like Milan, Juventus and Chelsea for example.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,032 Posts
Dutch big sides are levelled with portuguese dides
Dutch medium sides are a bit stronger than portuguese
Dutch small sides are a lot worse than portuguese

And of course, dutch league is underated just like portuguese league, because the leagues are not seen in the majority of european countries :rolleyes:
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
28 Posts
Prince-O said:
Also, most players in the eredivisie are technically and tactically superiour to most EPL players for instance. That's one thing.

Another thing is that our stadiums are always full, something we cannot say in Italy for instance. [/i]
You can't forget that most Serie A stadiums are huge, while in Holland most of them don't have more than 20.000 seats.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
10,421 Posts
Hurley said:
You can't forget that most Serie A stadiums are huge, while in Holland most of them don't have more than 20.000 seats.
So? You must not forget either that Italy is about 5 times the size of Holland.
 

·
Freedom for all
Joined
·
16,851 Posts
"I don`t really consider Feyenoord part of the top 3, I see them more as the number 3."

Isn't this quote a contradiction? If Feyenoord are "only" the number 3, then they WOULD be part of the top 3, wouldn't they?

Unless the top three are 1, 2, and 2.5. :D

Or am I reading that wrong? :googly:
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
259 Posts
ViscaBarcaInter said:
"I don`t really consider Feyenoord part of the top 3, I see them more as the number 3."

Isn't this quote a contradiction? If Feyenoord are "only" the number 3, then they WOULD be part of the top 3, wouldn't they?

Unless the top three are 1, 2, and 2.5. :D

Or am I reading that wrong? :googly:
Yeah you are reading it wrong. When youre considered part of a top 3,. it should mean you are equal to those other teams. Feyenoord though is clearly the number 3. Thats why I said Feyenoord isn`t part of the top 3, because for me there is no top 3 anymore. There is a top 2 and Feyenoord is behind that.

And Rataplan, this has got nothing to do with arrogance, this is an observation. You don`t hear me saying PSV isn`t a top team. Besides I don`t wonder what other fans think of me and why should I? Why the stereo typing anyways. All Feyenoord fans are loyal, all Ajax fans are arrogant....gimme a break...its really a sad way to go through life thinking so limited. You can say you dislike me, but I don`t represent the Ajax fanclub or the players, I represent myself on a discussion forum. I think Feyenoord fans dislike Ajax fans anyways, so this comment won`t shock them. But because you all like it so much, I will add it to my signature.
 
1 - 20 of 41 Posts
Top