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Discussion Starter #1 (Edited)
Actually I wanted to write this topic yesterday, but since the squad was named today (and certain news-events in the Benelux) I decided to wait a little. For the record this is the squad that was named by Scolari:

Goalkeepers: Marcos (Palmeiras), Rogerio Ceni (Sao Paulo), Dida (Corinthians)

Defenders: Cafu (Roma), Belletti (Sao Paulo), Junior (Parma), Roberto Carlos (Real Madrid), Lucio (Bayer Leverkusen), Roque Junior (AC Milan), Anderson Polga (Gremio), Edmilson (Lyon)

Midfielders: Gilberto Silva (Atletico Mineiro), Kleberson (Atletico Paranaense), Emerson (Roma), Vampeta (Corinthians), Ronaldo Assis (Paris Saint-Germain), Juninho Paulista (Flamengo), Kaka (Sao Paulo)

Forwards: Edilson (Cruzeiro), Denilson (Real Betis), Rivaldo (Barcelona), Ronaldo (Internazionale), Luizao (Gremio)


What this will mean for the actual line-up, can be worked out by people who know a bit more about the Brazil-based players. Since I don't really see midfielders for the wing I suppose that it will turn out to be a 3-5-2. The system in which worldclass players as Carlos and definitely Cafu are the most effective.


Still what I was really wondering was the fact that the first time in many many World Cups Brazil isn't in the list of favourites. Still if we look at the list of players that have been called up or could have been called up (Elber, Amorosso, Jardel, Assuncao,...) that is very surprising. It is stunning to see how many worldclass palyer are Brazilian (as a matter of fact that always has been stunning). Therefore the question could be raised why is this team struggling?

First I'm going to ait a little and afterwards I will goive me my point of view. traditionally Rivaldo has to do with it :D
 

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they are a collection of fine individuals, but not necessarily a team

i haven't seen them play recently, so cant judge current form, but about a year ago in qualification i got the impression that there was an over-arrogance to them "we are Brazil" - other teams have this as well, but they tend to get the results THEN the arrogance comes - with Brazil the arrogance is based on their fantastic history in international football, but not on what the current players have achieved.

Plus Rivaldo, a player on which too much reliance is placed open by the current Brazil team (and Barcelona too i think) is often poor when wearing the yellow jersey!
 

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I agree with Teddy Bear. We saw in La Paz that the Brazilian team can really shoot itself in the foot sometimes.

Leaving out Amoroso was a major mistake - but the demand to include as many Brazilian-based players as possibly got to Scolari. Betis have had a good year on their return to the Premeira Division, but not compared to Jardel at Sporting Lisbon. He's got 42 goals in just 30 games this year!
 

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Discussion Starter #4
My idea is that the keyfactor will be wether Scolari has the guts to bench Rivaldo. In a way this point of view is similar to the ones Teddy Bear and Bastin gave. With Rivaldo Brazil has the best player in the world, on individual bases. For the team however he's poison. I've stated on several occassion that I think it is a disgrace a team with soo many talented palyers should play in function of one guy (same goes for Barcelona).

Another point to worry about is that Rivaldo has had a very long season in which he was injured many times. I wonder how fit he will be. This too is a good reason to bench him in favour of one of the comming men like Kaka or Ronaldinho.

Another item are the forwards. Will Ronaldo be in form in time? If he is, he'll be a major asset to the Brazilian NT. The fact that he hasn't played this season means that he has more energy than the other players will have. Alomost every star on this WC will have a hard and tyring season behind him. Ronaldo doens't.

Still Scolari has taken a major risk. Leaving out Elber, Jardel, Amorosso and last but not least Romario for lesser names as Edilson adn Luizao. If they don't perform the critics will be ruteless. Can anybody give me some info on these last 2 players because to be honest I don't know them (unless Edilson is the same Edilson as the one that lead Corinthians to the WC some years ago).

Anywbody got an idea in which formation and with which names Brazil will play?
 

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Yes, this Edilson is the one that won the WCC with Corinthians in 1999. He now plays for Cruzeiro, after a stint at Flamengo and . If you need help finding information about him, his full name's Edilson da Silva Ferreira, but considering he's the one that you know, you probably know a lot about his style.

Luizao came into the Brazil team for the last qualifying game, against Venezuela. He managed to score twice in the first 20 minutes, and made the remainder of the game a formality.

Neither are particularly good players, and were lucky to get a World Cup ticket. They managed to do this on the back of their support in the Brazilian press, and although they aren't squeaky-clean themselves, their reputations are not as sullied as Romario's, and therefore, have more neutral support amongst Brazilians.

Personally, I wouldn't have taken them. This seems quite easy to say, but there were probably 'incentives' to take Luizao and Edilson. Amoroso and Jardel would hav replaced them for me.
 

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I'd never have left Romario out, he's just too good a player to leave at home. It would be like Italy leaving out Montella or Argentina leaving Batigol at home.
 

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No, it's like England leaving out Gazza from the squad right now. He's a washed-up over-hyped player, who is well past his best (about 10 years ago), who proved to be a pretty poor husband. Parallels with Gazza...
 

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Just for the record, this is the projected line up Scolari will use.

Marcos

Lucio - Roque Junior - Anderson Polga

Cafu - Gilberto Silva - Emerson - Roberto Carlos

Ronaldinho

Ronaldo - Rivaldo

I know this is not debate forum material, but I cant write more now, I'll write my thoughts tomorrow, please, have patience with me. :)
 

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Bastin said:
No, it's like England leaving out Gazza from the squad right now. He's a washed-up over-hyped player, who is well past his best (about 10 years ago), who proved to be a pretty poor husband. Parallels with Gazza...
Romario is the top goal scorer in the Brazilian league, whilst Gazza is a washed up drunk who can't cut it in the English First Division. I can see the similarities:rolleyes:

The fact is that Romario is still the best striker Brazil have, & they will sorely miss him at the World Cup.

I couldn't leave with out posting a reply, because comparing Romario to Gazza is just insulting.
 

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Sorry guy,
But Romario is the best center forward that has existed in the planet. The top scorer by a mile of the world in the last 3 years. The second bigest goalscorer of the history of the game.

And Luizao and edilson are bigger names than Jardel and Amoroso.

The only big misteake felipao did in the call up was leave romario and juninho pernambucano out..all the other decisions he made will not make the SLIGHTEST difference in the WC.

And we are gonna be champions!:tongue: ;)
 

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Discussion Starter #11
Ze don't you think the centre of the Brazilian defence is somewhat of a questionmark. Only Lucio is a worldclass player.

On the other hand you think the strikers that are now selected will make the difference? They are all good players, but are they really goalmachines?
 

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God,
That' s why we have 3. If we had 2 world class defeders , we would only have 2 defenders.

Luizao is a goal machine, injured or not. No forward in Europe can dribble like Edilson can, only Denilson!. Ronaldinho Gaucho is a matured player now, reaching the peak of his form....he will be the essential thing in the team.

Plus, in every major country in Europe we had a brasilian that was champion...even in Italy if you consider the Coppa Italia a decent trophy!
 

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I think that Romario is too old to play for the Brazilian national team,he is no use to them any more (just like Hislop for Ross county.) The only chance they have of doing anything in the world cup is if Ronaldo is fully fit.
 

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I thought that the projected line up had Vampeta in it!!

Anyway the chances of Brasil for me rest on one man and that is Ronaldo... I'm not saying that Brazil are bad I'm just saying that Ronaldo, at his best, is that good.

He is without doubt the best player in the world that I have ever seen... his ball control, power, finishing, speed :drool:

The problem is without him they have no striker who can score frequently for them... Romario should be in there I don't really understand why he is not (is it politics or are people just judging him on age alone?)

I would love to see Denilson play with Ronaldinho but know that the chances of this are slim... I could watch these two play all day:)

But be warned the world Brazil are still a force and are liable to get better the longet the tournament goes on... just think of what a confident Brazilian can play like.

One final thing is that the defence is bad... I mean even Lucio is not excellent defensive wise... but when have Brazil ever relied on defence that much (yes I know they had Marcio Santos and Aldair but even then emphasis was on attacking).
 
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