[Jeff]

Hi, people. :nerd:

With Bonita's sudden departure the Forum Manager's job has fallen to me. She will be sorely missed, but I hope she'll drop in again and see us once in a while.

Don't expect any radical changes; I'll try to keep things going as Bonita would have wanted.

This forum is different from most others at Xtratime in at least two ways:

First, it has a potentially huge subject-matter in women's soccer - everything from club teams to national teams, and virtually every country, continent and soccer confederation on the planet. Obviously we can't cover it all, but we can cover as much of it as you the members want. This requires a perhaps higher degree of organization of threads than you find in other forums - otherwise chaos would ensue and nobody could find anything. So we will continue to try to establish major threads for the major tournaments and competitions, and make them as easy as possible to locate.

Second, it's hard to find women's soccer information and news on the internet, unlike the situation with men's soccer. What little there is is often out of date or simply inaccurate. Some of the best sources of information are in languages other than English. And so I think this forum has a big role to play in helping to share information that's hard to find elsewhere.

I would also like to say something about the occasional problem we have with trolls attacking this forum. I'm talking of course about those who think it's a bit of a lark to drop in to the Women's Soccer forum and try to provoke an argument by saying something ignorant about how inferior women's soccer is, or by making personal attacks.

I don't think we need to spend time in this forum trying to defend or justify the existence of women's soccer, or trying to compare it to men's soccer. Women's soccer is a sport in its own right, and it's here to stay. If you don't accept that, then you are free to ignore this forum.

That's the approach I intend to take.

 

[dutchy]

Jeff ,

though Bonita will be missed in this forum, I'm sure you'll do a great job in keeping this forum going
and if you ever come across an article in dutch, german or french you need help with translating, feel free to ask.....
thuogh a wise ol' man like you probably won't need help with that :tongue:

 

[AMOROSO!]

I would also like to say something about the occasional problem we have with trolls attacking this forum. I'm talking of course about those who think it's a bit of a lark to drop in to the Women's Soccer forum and try to provoke an argument by saying something ignorant about how inferior women's soccer is, or by making personal attacks.

Gotta love your generalisations. When these "trolls" ( ) show up you could simply try to see their point and have a discussion with them. Taking this "I'm not talking to you approach :stuckup:" does not help much at all in a forum which is made for discussion... And I of course refer to those who come to discuss.

I don't think we need to spend time in this forum trying to defend or justify the existence of women's soccer, or trying to compare it to men's soccer. Women's soccer is a sport in its own right, and it's here to stay. If you don't accept that, then you are free to ignore this forum.

So a contructive discussion with good arguments is not possible, eh? Nice.

 

[dutchy]

Amoroso,
believe me, we did try to "discuss" the issue with these "trolls" but it never got as far as a serious discussion. With trolls Jeff means the guys who come into our forum just to provoke and say e.g."women shoulden't be allowed to play soccer" And when you ask for arguments,they can't get any further than "women can't play soccer". And the times we did gave some arguments back, such as that professional women's soccer is more enjoyable to watch cuz it involves more tactics" the only kinda replies we got is "women's soccer just sucks except for the boobs".
So after all those failed discussion you get tired of trying to discussith them.
I agree with Jeff.

 

[AMOROSO!]

Dutchy, I (and not only me) have participated in a couple of these discussions with some very good arguments only to have to face this "if you dont like it, stay away! :stuckup:" attitude. This is just not right. Those who come like you say, dont worth attention. But people like Jeff (sorry Jeff, its a fact) just refuse to discuss anything remotely close to a topic which might include some good argumentation against women's football (and I'm not talking putting it down without reason, but for examble refering to the financial differences).

In my opinion this kind of discussions should not only be rebuffled, but even encouraged. Jeff does not do that and she clearly states her intentions to not do it... that for me is no game for a moderator.

 

[dutchy]

Amoroso, what Jeff implied with his post is that he (! ) doesn't want discussions with "trolls" about wether or not women's soccer should exist. I'm sure that if you need a serious, useful discussion about something other than "the existence of women's soccer" and "wether or not women's soccer sucks", Jeff won't say no in advance. But i guess Jeff can tell you better than me....

 

[AMOROSO!]

Fair enough Dutchy, thats my issue. Of course I dont suggest you tolerate provocators.

Oh and I thought Jeff was female, should have understood better from the name though. My apologies.

 

[Jeff]

Oh and I thought Jeff was female, should have understood better from the name though. My apologies.

Yeah, right.

And I thought you were from Sri Lanka.

 

[AMOROSO!]

What's your problem???

On second thoughts, perhaps I shouldn't have apologised... because only a woman who haven't had sex for a LONG, LONG time could be SO annoying.

 

[Jeff]

Thanks for illustrating my point about trolls so very nicely.

 

[dutchy]

*agrees with Jeff, again* :tongue:

 

[AMOROSO!]

You did very well yourself in illustrating my point about you being an annoying, inefficient and particularly poor in discussion moderator. I genuinely apologised and you turned to me with irony, I dont appreciate that.

 

[mutu1875]

I dont really see what the issue is here. There are obviously people who wish to debate the quality/existance/whatever of womens football, so why not let them, if you dont want to debate it avoid the thread: no-one will make you debate it. To dismiss any kind of debate on the matter, on the grounds that you personally find it annoying would be ridiculous and not how an FM should act.

This is an issue womens football as a whole is going to have to face up to if it is going to be considered a major sport outside of North America.

 

[Jeff]

if you dont want to debate it avoid the thread: no-one will make you debate it.

The point is that I'm being personally attacked because I don't want to debate the issue.

I don't go to other forums, like say, the Parma forum, and expect people there to engage me in a debate about whether Italians can (or should be allowed to) play soccer; or whether there should even be a Parma forum; or whether the kind of soccer Parma plays is worth watching. Anybody wanting that kind of debate is not interested in exchanging views, or changing others' minds, but is more interested in showing off, provocation, or insults, or god knows what other motives. Debates like that (if you can really call them debates) can and should be held in neutral territory like the Debate forum or Universal Soccer forum.

I didn't seek the FM job, it came to me. I don't own this forum - I'm a volunteer. But I intend to make sure the forum rules (which I did not write) are not abused.

I also think that women members (for whom this forum really exists) should be able to feel comfortable posting here without having to endure taunts and insults from testosterone-addled adolescents and their elder apologists.

Anybody can complain to the Xtratime administration if they don't like the way I act. I will be happy to answer to them.

And personal insults can be sent to me via Personal Messaging.

 

[Fred Elliot]

All the best Jeff. I wish you lots of luck in what appears to be a job fraught with no small difficulties

 

[AMOROSO!]

The point is that I'm being personally attacked because I don't want to debate the issue.

Thats not really the issue, is it? you came out declaring that part of your moderating duties will be to rid of the forum of such debates, at least this is what I made of your words.

I don't go to other forums, like say, the Parma forum, and expect people there to engage me in a debate about whether Italians can (or should be allowed to) play soccer; or whether there should even be a Parma forum; or whether the kind of soccer Parma plays is worth watching.

As you should understand, the example you bring is quite bad. You know very well that the female football has some differences and these differences and problems make a very valid topic of a discussion in a football forum. You are more than welcome to come and debate with good argumentation that Parma plays great football or that their tramsfer policy is lame. Critics, along with the very enjoyable task of coming up with "solutions" are great debating topics.

Anybody wanting that kind of debate is not interested in exchanging views, or changing others' minds, but is more interested in showing off, provocation, or insults, or god knows what other motives. Debates like that (if you can really call them debates) can and should be held in neutral territory like the Debate forum or Universal Soccer forum.

You generalise without any proofs. I tried a few times to have a debate on the financial aspect of the game in female football but all my efforts met YOUR denial and negative attitude. I really hope this will change now that you're a moderator.

I didn't seek the FM job, it came to me. I don't own this forum - I'm a volunteer. But I intend to make sure the forum rules (which I did not write) are not abused.

The purpose of this forum is to debate on football issues. If you refuse to engage in a valid discussion its your problem, but you have no right to rid the forum of those discussions because you dont like them, as long as they are within the boundaries of the rules.

I also think that women members (for whom this forum really exists) should be able to feel comfortable posting here without having to endure taunts and insults from testosterone-addled adolescents and their elder apologists.

Ah really? This forum exists for women members only? what is this? a girls club? Then what are you doing in here? This forum is for female football and everything about it and it should be open for both male and females. As for the rest ridiculous and pointless generalisations you make, well, duh...

I'm not asking you to tolerate people who come here to annoy you, but you need to accept that debate on the shortcomings as well as the advantages of female football should be accepted, if not encouraged. Mutu pointed it out perfectly. If you're not ready to accept this and you insist on sencoring this kind of topics, then you're not the right man for the job. I don't care enough to bother myself in asking your removal or something, but sooner or later someone sensible will.

This is a forum for discussions. Topics of discussions we might or might not like, but discussions should be allowed nontheless.

 

[Pila]

As far as I'm concerned, revealing one's inferiority complexes is not against the rules. So, if some genderphobic p*ssy ass wants the right to express his absurdity and his insecurites by questioning whether Soccer is a sport, I say let him so we can all laugh at his pantsy ass.

 

[dutchy]

hush it Amoroso
(gosh, i don't even feel you're worth replying to since you're only here to piss Jeff off....)

but oh well..i'll try to take you serious..

the women's soccer forum is, unlike the other forums, more a forum to keep each other informed about women's soccer throughout the world since it is hard to find info about games played etc. Of course there is also room for debating, but most contributing debates are about players or matches played by people who've actually seen them play. So unlike most other forums, this aint just a forum for debates. It's main importance is to inform each other about what's happening in the women's soccer world.

and can you tell me what thread it was you posted in about finance?

 

[RazorUK]

Let me just clarify that, this forum along with every other forum is here to discuss the topic of it's forum.

Therefore any sensible and polite debates regarding Women's soccer should not be a problem.

If a thread gets out of hand and people just say "Women's soccer sucks" Just move the thread to the padded cell. Simplisitc stupid posts like that can be closed or whatever but if someone comes in with a good argument backed up with statistics, fans average and etc. Then these IMHO are to be allowed.

The forums are not just for the good points of the forum topic, but also to allow those with a differing view to participate. That must however be done in a non flaming manner.

Thankyou for listening

Razor

 

[mutu1875]

Im in agreement with Razor. You must be willing to discuss the shortcommings of womens football as well as other things. Womens football, and this forum, cant go around in a bubble dimssing anyone who questions the merits of the sport. Otherwise, womens soccer will remain a minority sport all over the world, and in america too.