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post #1 of 21 (permalink) Old July 10th, 2006, 23:32 Thread Starter
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Some interesting statistics

I have been taken by the unfairness of the fact that south american countries are not well-represented in the world cup, and I have done a quick research trying to understand in what basis are we as fans forced to watch a world cup with a significant number of teams full of semi-professional and ex-football players.
I was surprised to see that CONMEBOL with half the cup wins only has 4 representatives (the 5th lost in the play-offs), the SAME as CONCACAF (!), the same as ASIA and one less than Africa (!). So here is how the continents fared in this world cup:

Asia: - 4 teams (Iran, Japan, Korea, Saudi) 3 of them finished 4th in the group, one finished third, none progressed.
Total no. of points: 7 (0.6 per game)
Goals: 9-24

Africa: - 5 teams (Tunisia, CIV, Angola, Ghana, Togo), one progressed as second, 3 of them third, one fourth.
Total no. of points: 12 (0.8 per game)
Goals: 14-23

Ghana went through only to lose 0-3 to Brazil.

CONCACAF: - 4 teams (T&T, Costa Rica, Mexico, USA), 3 of them finished 4th and Mexico progressed as second.
Total no. of points: 6!!!! (0.5 per game!!!)
Goals: 9-22

Mexico went through and lost to Argentina 1-2.


CONMEBOL: - 4 teams (Brazil, Argentina, Ecuador, Paraguay), 2 of them finished first, one second, one third
Total no. of points: 25 (2.1 p.g.)
Goals: 22-7

Brazil and Argentina in one of their worst World cups ever went out in the quarter finals and Ecuador in the first knock-out round. In total the 4 teams from CONMEBOL gathered more points than 13 other teams from ASIA, AFRICA and N.AMERICA!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


Still with all that difference, Uruguay after having to overcome Colombia, Chile, and Peru (all of them countries that have swamped the big european championships with top-class players) had to go to play-offs with Australia that was preparing for these two matches for 4 years while battling with the football might of the Solomon islands and Tasmania.

I find this utterly unfair. FIFA has only increased the number of teams from 24 to 32 for the sole reason of expanding football to places that they couldn't care less only for us to watch a parody of a WC. No disrespect to the small countries, but in the WC I am expecting to see some nice football not 11 players in the small area defending free kicks. In the past even the small teams had some dignity and played decent football, like Cameroon or Morocco.

I believe that CONMEBOL should officially complain on that matter. FIFA rankings are a complete joke. And I am not mentioning Europe, where for a European team it is easier to go through the WC groups than the actual qualification (like Ukraine, France, etc)
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post #2 of 21 (permalink) Old July 11th, 2006, 03:58
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I agree.

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post #3 of 21 (permalink) Old July 11th, 2006, 10:40
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Quote:
I believe that CONMEBOL should officially complain on that matter. FIFA rankings are a complete joke. And I am not mentioning Europe, where for a European team it is easier to go through the WC groups than the actual qualification (like Ukraine, France, etc)
Conmebol has spent countless hrs ans countless $$$$ Im sure..trying to convince Fifa..But So far..nothing...Heck not even with big mafioso Havelange we got anywhere on the subject...


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post #4 of 21 (permalink) Old July 11th, 2006, 14:00
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You make some good points, but the fact remains that CONMEBOL only has ten teams. 50% of those teams usually qualify, that should be plenty. The only option to increase the number of CONMEBOL teams would be to merge your zone with CONCACAF, because in the current system it would be crazy if 7 out of 10 (70%) of the teams in your qualifying were guaranteed a place in the World Cup. Wouldn't be much of a qualifying left. You should also remember that teams like Cameroon, Nigeria, Romania, Denmark and several other great football teams failed to qualify in tough qualifications in their zones. After all, it was Europe that dominated the World Cup. It is also important to admit that Brazil and Argentina pull your zone ahead. Behind the two great teams CONMEBOL hardly has results to put you ahead of the best teams from other zones (apart from Uruguay's long lost glory) like Mexico, USA, Cameroon, Nigeria, Australia, and South Korea. I would love to see a merge between the zones happen though, with just four zones left:

Europe
America (south and north)
Africa
Asia/Oceania
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post #5 of 21 (permalink) Old July 11th, 2006, 19:49 Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Orange
You make some good points, but the fact remains that CONMEBOL only has ten teams. 50% of those teams usually qualify, that should be plenty.
If you consider Tahiti and the Cayman Islands as football nations you 're right. Otherwise CONCACAF, AFC and even CAF have less 'teams'.

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The only option to increase the number of CONMEBOL teams would be to merge your zone with CONCACAF, because in the current system it would be crazy if 7 out of 10 (70%) of the teams in your qualifying were guaranteed a place in the World Cup.
It would be fair, because then USA and the likes would never qualify instead of Uruguay or Chile or Paraguay, but this is a nightmare for FIFA who would rather let hopeless USA fans spend a fraction of their time (and their money) to watch their 10th favourite sport play in the WC and fail miserably, than countries who LIVE AND BREATH FOOTBALL and a WC participation would be a national celebration.

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You should also remember that teams like Cameroon, Nigeria, Romania, Denmark and several other great football teams failed to qualify in tough qualifications in their zones.
I already said about the african preliminaries that are the most ridiculous ever (groups are very uneven and only the first qualifies), and as for Europe I haven't mentioned it because I also believe Europe should have had more teams

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After all, it was Europe that dominated the World Cup.
Europe dominated THIS world cup, but with more than three times as many teams in world cups has the same number of wins. For a continent with 5 as many teams thats not really exceptional...

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It is also important to admit that Brazil and Argentina pull your zone ahead. Behind the two great teams CONMEBOL hardly has results to put you ahead of the best teams from other zones (apart from Uruguay's long lost glory) like Mexico, USA, Cameroon, Nigeria, Australia, and South Korea.
1. Uruguay have won 2 cups, a feat that NONE of the above will ever accomplish, and two more semi-finals (1954, 1970).
2. Chile have reached the semi-finals too (1962) and recently the last-16 (1998)
3. Paraguay have qualified 3 times to the last 16 (86, 98, 02) and have finished second in an Olympics tournament
4. Colombia has reached the last 16 in 1990 and had a remarkably strong team in 1994
5. Ecuador reached the last 16 in 2006
6. Peru reached the quarter-finals in 1970 and in 1978

Bolivia (who has qualified a few times) and Venezuela (without qualifications) who are the poorest sides - although I can assure you that the latter would most definitely beat the likes of Trinidad, Iran or Togo - are the only ones who have never gone through the groups. So they have all tasted a little bit of success and most importantly have produced some nice football and memorable players (Cubillas, Delgado, Valderrama, Higuita, Chilavert, Salas, Zamorano, Francescoli, to name a few)

Of the teams you mentioned USA has gone to the quarter finals twice (once at home), Australia went to the last 16 once (from the easiest group) while they hadn't even scored (!) prior to this WC, Cameroon just made it once to the quarter finals, Nigeria twice in the last-16 and only S.Korea has tasted a bit of success (at home of course) and we all remember how that happened

Finally Mexico who are in effect a latin country, have only reached the quarter-finals, both AT HOME. And lets not argue at how well the South American teams would have fared had there been any world cups hosted in this continent (the last one was almost 30 years ago)


So South America fares better than all of them even without Brazil and Argentina. In no other place in the world is football celebrated more, and more teams should qualify, not to mention that Brazil has to host a WC to see what football is all about AT LAST
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post #6 of 21 (permalink) Old July 11th, 2006, 21:10
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Well with 2014 in Brazil...we should get a decent contingent to represent us !!!

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post #7 of 21 (permalink) Old July 11th, 2006, 22:42
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I wouldn't mind a merging of the CONCACAF and COMEBOL and have 7 total spots and 1 playoff

Divide us into a few groups... interesting
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post #8 of 21 (permalink) Old July 12th, 2006, 00:21 Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bernmilan1
I wouldn't mind a merging of the CONCACAF and COMEBOL and have 7 total spots and 1 playoff

Divide us into a few groups... interesting
this will never happen... can you imagine Bolivia or Ecuador flying out to Canada or... Bahamas for a qualifier? p :smileani:

there could be more playoffs though...
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post #9 of 21 (permalink) Old July 12th, 2006, 10:14
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No .....actually what would be funnier would b the xact opposite .... Can you see Bahamas playing in La Paz ?????? They'd take home back to the island 20 + goals, courtesy of the Titicacos !!!!! :dielaugh:

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post #10 of 21 (permalink) Old July 12th, 2006, 20:01 Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by colocolo
No .....actually what would be funnier would b the xact opposite .... Can you see Bahamas playing in La Paz ?????? They'd take home back to the island 20 + goals, courtesy of the Titicacos !!!!! :dielaugh:
at around the 60th minute of the game you 'd see oxygen masks appearing p
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post #11 of 21 (permalink) Old July 12th, 2006, 22:00
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The real problem is in Concacaf. I think it´s very unfair that they get so many direct places in the WC; we´ll see Mexico and USA always in the WC. There is no way they can be out if we see the level of the other nations.
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post #12 of 21 (permalink) Old July 12th, 2006, 22:03
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Mexico almost failed to qualify for 2002.

They only did because Honduras threw it away against Trinidad\Tobago at home.

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post #13 of 21 (permalink) Old July 13th, 2006, 02:12
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If Honduras and T&T can keep you out of the WC, your level is clear.

This summarize well Concacaf:

CONCACAF: - 4 teams (T&T, Costa Rica, Mexico, USA), 3 of them finished 4th and Mexico progressed as second.
Total no. of points: 6 (0.5 per game!!!)
Goals: 9-22


I have nothing against them, but do they really deserve 3 direct places and one play-off?
At least they should do one direct place and 3 play-offs, being generous.
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post #14 of 21 (permalink) Old July 13th, 2006, 10:08
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But you see......Leoz hasnt done the job the President of Concacaf did......Do you think Fifa out of the goodness of their heart goes out assigning spots ??? Heck no .... Concacaf did 1 helluva sell job to get where they are !!!!

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post #15 of 21 (permalink) Old July 13th, 2006, 16:07
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potentially south america can send 5 of its 10 members to the cup, as in 98 and 02. what else do you want?

Quote:
Originally Posted by colocolo
Conmebol has spent countless hrs ans countless $$$$ Im sure..trying to convince Fifa..But So far..nothing...Heck not even with big mafioso Havelange we got anywhere on the subject...

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post #16 of 21 (permalink) Old July 13th, 2006, 16:13
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uniting concacaf and conmebol is a very good idea. i'd say 7 or 8 places for that unified zone. europe with 15 or 16, africa with 5 and asia/oceania with 4 (they deserve less, but in the spirit of promoting the game).
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post #17 of 21 (permalink) Old July 13th, 2006, 18:20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ampersand
potentially south america can send 5 of its 10 members to the cup, as in 98 and 02. what else do you want?
I want nothing...Im just responding to the one who started this thread...
I havent complained !!!!!

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post #18 of 21 (permalink) Old July 14th, 2006, 16:48 Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ampersand
uniting concacaf and conmebol is a very good idea. i'd say 7 or 8 places for that unified zone. europe with 15 or 16, africa with 5 and asia/oceania with 4 (they deserve less, but in the spirit of promoting the game).
as far as CONCACAF that would be totally fair

we 'd probably never see a non-latin country from the continent in the WC again, but personally I m not bothered

5 out of 10 when the 6th is Colombia and the 7th is Chile is not enough
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post #19 of 21 (permalink) Old July 14th, 2006, 21:45
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Some further interesting statistics....

New FIFA men's Ranking: South Americans advanced 107 places

13 / 07 / 2006




This Wednesday July 12, FIFA published its new World Classification of men's national teams, which, from this edition, has a new method of calculation and elaboration.

This new system of determining the international ranking of teams was of great benefit for South America. Compared to the previous ranking process, all South American national teams climbed positions (107 in total), with the exception of Brazil, which remains in first place.

There are eight South American national teams among the top 50 in the world in the new ranking; besides having the 1st and the 3rd positions (Brazil and Argentina).

This is how the South Americans now stand in the FIFA World Classification of men's teams (the number of places climbed is shown in parenthesis):

1st Brazil (0)
3rd Argentina (6)
14th Uruguay (8)
19th Paraguay (14)
21th Colombia (6)
28th Ecuador (11)
42nd Peru (24)
46th Chile (18)
68th Venezuela (3)
85th Bolivia (17)

Consult the complete Ranking in the FIFA web page: www.fifa.com

Peru, Chile and Bolivia with the highest climbs alltogetther !!!

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post #20 of 21 (permalink) Old August 13th, 2006, 14:07
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CONMEBOL World Cup Qualifiers:

This is the list of the teams that participated of each World Cup. For further information on the qualification process and withdrawals, see the (Q) corresponding links (the first world cup of 1930 didn't have any qualification process). Names marked in bold represent occasions when a CONMEBOL member won the tournament.

1930(-) - Argentina, Bolivia, Brazil, Chile, Paraguay, Peru, Uruguay
1934(Q) - Argentina, Brazil
1938(Q) - Brazil
1950(Q) - Bolivia, Brazil, Chile, Paraguay, Uruguay
1954(Q) - Brazil, Uruguay
1958(Q) - Argentina, Brazil, Paraguay
1962(Q) - Argentina, Brazil, Chile, Colombia, Uruguay
1966(Q) - Argentina, Brazil, Chile, Uruguay
1970(Q) - Brazil, Peru, Uruguay
1974(Q) - Argentina, Brazil, Chile, Uruguay
1978(Q) - Argentina, Brazil, Peru
1982(Q) - Argentina, Brazil, Chile, Peru
1986(Q) - Argentina, Brazil, Paraguay, Uruguay
1990(Q) - Argentina, Brazil, Colombia, Uruguay
1994(Q) - Argentina, Bolivia, Brazil, Colombia
1998(Q) - Argentina, Brazil, Chile, Colombia, Paraguay
2002(Q) - Argentina, Brazil, Ecuador, Paraguay, Uruguay
2006(Q) - Argentina, Brazil, Ecuador, Paraguay


Total participations

18 - Brazil
14 - Argentina
10 - Uruguay
7 - Chile, Paraguay
4 - Colombia, Peru
3 - Bolivia
2 - Ecuador
0 - Venezuela

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