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post #1 of 19 (permalink) Old June 14th, 2008, 22:55 Thread Starter
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4-4-2 vs 4-2-3-1

Well, most of teams are playing either 4-4-2 or 4-2-3-1. Who do you think it is better, more impressive and effective?

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post #2 of 19 (permalink) Old June 14th, 2008, 22:59
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4-2-3-1 ... its more effective, when u attack u have basically 3 strikers and when defending you don't loose 1 player (since we all know that strikers don't always return to help the defence and midfield)
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post #3 of 19 (permalink) Old June 14th, 2008, 22:59
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4-4-2 is always going to have more of a presence in the box, while 4-2-3-1 will always allow more freedom for the midfielders and better ball possession.

Anyhow, Portugal play 4-3-3. I wouldn't call it a 4-2-3-1 because Deco is much deeper than Ronaldo and Simao, he's part of the 3 midfielders. I prefer this style but it is dependent on wingers who can score, because the striker is going to be isolated most of the time.

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post #4 of 19 (permalink) Old June 14th, 2008, 23:01 Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Joshua View Post
4-4-2 is always going to have more of a presence in the box, while 4-2-3-1 will always allow more freedom for the midfielders and better ball possession.

Anyhow, Portugal play 4-3-3. I wouldn't call it a 4-2-3-1 because Deco is much deeper than Ronaldo and Simao, he's part of the 3 midfielders. I prefer this style but it is dependent on wingers who can score, because the striker is going to be isolated most of the time.
Well, 4-3-3 can easily turn into 4-2-3-1. In the dutch case, 4-2-3-1 is more effective than the dull 4-3-3 they were applying.

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"For a moment there I returned to my youth, the early youth, when all nice illusions were gathered together. Then life came and, like a strong wind, blew them away, one by one. What we call happiness is sometimes the accordance between our life and circumstances, our biography and history, our personal aspirations and historical currents. If I look at things that way, I can say: I was born too early to be happy. But birth is one of the many things we do not get to choose. It is part of our destiny."
Alija Izetbegovic


"وما الحيله فقد اراد اعدائي ان يغطوا كل خدماتي بغطاء اسود وقد نجحوا في ذلك."

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post #5 of 19 (permalink) Old June 14th, 2008, 23:03
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4-2-3-1 needs a striker with great movement.

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post #6 of 19 (permalink) Old June 14th, 2008, 23:03
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4-2-3-1 needs a striker with great movement.
Headless chicken like our boy Forrest
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post #7 of 19 (permalink) Old June 14th, 2008, 23:09
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Depends on what players a team has at its disposal. Sweden are limited to 4-4-2, which is fine I think - good balance. I dont think 4-2-3-1 would work for us.
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post #8 of 19 (permalink) Old June 14th, 2008, 23:10
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Headless chicken like our boy Forrest
exactly, i bet it wouldn't have worked with Klasnic or Budan.

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post #9 of 19 (permalink) Old June 14th, 2008, 23:11
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Headless chicken like our boy Forrest
He really is the perfect forward for such a system. Applies pressure for 90 minutes, and never lets a backline settle on the ball. He'd run right through a brick wall if instructed, I'm sure of it.

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post #10 of 19 (permalink) Old June 14th, 2008, 23:19
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exactly, i bet it wouldn't have worked with Klasnic or Budan.
Well Klasnic isn't that static. But with Budan that would be terrible (as we could have seen against Austria) since he is static striker who need ball in 16m.
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post #11 of 19 (permalink) Old June 14th, 2008, 23:23
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Originally Posted by dabdob View Post
Well, 4-3-3 can easily turn into 4-2-3-1. In the dutch case, 4-2-3-1 is more effective than the dull 4-3-3 they were applying.
In our case it was a huge difference...

Qualification matches (4-3-3):

Luxembourgh - Holland = 0-1
Holland - Belarus = 3-0
Bulgaria - Holland = 1-1
Holland - Albania = 2-1
Holland - Romania = 0-0
Slovenia - Holland = 0-1
Holland - Bulgaria = 2-0
Albania - Holland = 0-1
Romania - Holland = 1-0
Holland - Slovenia = 2-0
Holland - Luxembourgh = 1-0
Belarus - Holland = 2-1

Goal average (12 matches): 15-5

**************************

Pre-friendlies (4-2-3-1)

Croatia - Holland = 0-3
Austria - Holland = 3-4
Holland - Ukraine = 3-0
Holland - Denmark = 1-1
Holland - Wales = 2-0

Holland - Italy = 3-0
Holland - France = 4-1

Goal average (7 matches): 20-5

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post #12 of 19 (permalink) Old June 15th, 2008, 01:23
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Always depends on the players you have and sometimes the opponent.

The 4-2-3-1 system requires an advanced striker who's both strong, fast and does a lot of work.

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post #13 of 19 (permalink) Old June 15th, 2008, 09:27
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A perfectly executed 4-3-3 will always own the systems mentioned. Anyway, out of the two, I think the 4-2-3-1 is better, since you can turn it easily into an attacking formation when you are in possession.

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post #14 of 19 (permalink) Old June 15th, 2008, 09:30
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Depends on what players a team has at its disposal. Sweden are limited to 4-4-2, which is fine I think - good balance. I dont think 4-2-3-1 would work for us.
Exactly. No such thing as a superior formation.
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post #15 of 19 (permalink) Old June 15th, 2008, 10:07 Thread Starter
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Exactly. No such thing as a superior formation.
I still think that 4-4-2 is more stable and balanced. The 4-2-3-1 could be defensive as hell, just like what happened in WC2006!

My weekly rant!

27th May 1965: Over 16,000 days.

"For a moment there I returned to my youth, the early youth, when all nice illusions were gathered together. Then life came and, like a strong wind, blew them away, one by one. What we call happiness is sometimes the accordance between our life and circumstances, our biography and history, our personal aspirations and historical currents. If I look at things that way, I can say: I was born too early to be happy. But birth is one of the many things we do not get to choose. It is part of our destiny."
Alija Izetbegovic


"وما الحيله فقد اراد اعدائي ان يغطوا كل خدماتي بغطاء اسود وقد نجحوا في ذلك."

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post #16 of 19 (permalink) Old June 15th, 2008, 13:22
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If you have two great forwards that can work together effectively 4-4-2 makes a whole lot of sense. It all depends on what players you have at your disposal. The popularity of 4-4-2 is also in it's simplicity, it's probably one of the easier formations to coach (especially here in England).

Overall, the fashion nowadays seems to be playing one striker upfront, two wide players that give the illusion of it being a 4-3-3 but arent proper wingers because they retreat to add more to the midfield (making it 5) and 3 in the centre who share the ballwinning and organizing play, shifting across the park as a unit. Mourinho did it so well with Chelsea and plenty of other EPL clubs toyed with the idea of playing one forward too. Lots of teams in Euro 2008 do a similar thing.
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post #17 of 19 (permalink) Old June 16th, 2008, 16:08
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4-2-3-1 if you've got a squad filled with technical players. Never liked the 4-4-2, rather go with a 4-4-1-1 with a #10 in the hole.

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post #18 of 19 (permalink) Old June 16th, 2008, 16:10
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If you have two great forwards that can work together effectively 4-4-2 makes a whole lot of sense. It all depends on what players you have at your disposal. The popularity of 4-4-2 is also in it's simplicity, it's probably one of the easier formations to coach (especially here in England).

Overall, the fashion nowadays seems to be playing one striker upfront, two wide players that give the illusion of it being a 4-3-3 but arent proper wingers because they retreat to add more to the midfield (making it 5) and 3 in the centre who share the ballwinning and organizing play, shifting across the park as a unit. Mourinho did it so well with Chelsea and plenty of other EPL clubs toyed with the idea of playing one forward too. Lots of teams in Euro 2008 do a similar thing.
There are a lot of 4-4-2 formations.. if you play classic 4-4-2 with 2 wingers and 2 central midfielders then it´s easy, but if you play the diamond 4-4-2 it´s not so easy to coach. You need a great mobility in the midfield and a lot of homework if you want it to work.


By the way, if you have a classy striker (to finish what the team builds for him to finish) and a ace nº10 (that makes the team play arround him), then 4-2-3-1 is the best formation to play. If you don´t, then it´s better to play another formation, with more support up front to the striker.
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post #19 of 19 (permalink) Old June 16th, 2008, 16:31
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4-4-2 has it's appeal for requiring the least amount of specialization and in today's world of transfers and injuries, it works out very well. 4-4-2 only has three positions in the midfield and attack: CM, side midfielder, and striker. Most other formations require a higher degree of specialization. Also, the distinction between side and central midfielder isn't that great, so only two types of players are necessary for a 4-4-2, whereas in a 4-3-3, 4-4-2 Diamond, or 4-2-3-1, you need four different types of players.
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