Euro 2008 Qualifiers: Israel - Estonia - Xtratime Community
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post #1 of 44 (permalink) Old March 25th, 2007, 14:57 Thread Starter
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Euro 2008 Qualifiers: Israel - Estonia

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Venue: Ramat Gan Stadium

Time: 28 March 2007 19:00 (local time)

Well our boys should take this one. Not by a huge margin because Estonia is not like Andorra but we need to take advantage of this game. Something tells me that if we will have a chance at qualifying it'll be down to goal difference and this time we need to make sure we get through. From what I understand Benado is injured so that will be a bit of a problem, hopefully Kashtan realizes that we need to play full force attack of 4-3-3 with Tamuz, Ben Sahar, and Colautti up front.
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post #2 of 44 (permalink) Old March 25th, 2007, 15:51
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Well with all the respect to Estonia if we don´t convince and win well against them then we could forget Euro 2008. I still think we have chances to go through even though slimmer then we thought from the beginning.
Benado had a very good game against England and despite not being so used to play in the defensive midfielder role he had an excellent display. He is in doubt for the game, but don´t forget that Idan Tal returns from suspension so probably he will naturally sub Benado if this occurs. Balili will come out for Collauti and we will probably have the same team that faced England.
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post #3 of 44 (permalink) Old March 25th, 2007, 17:52 Thread Starter
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you think we'll still play a 4-4-2, if we do then Kashtan is an idiot again. He needs to understand that we need goals now. This is a tight group and something tells me that the goal difference will really take effect in the end. We need to attack full force.
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post #4 of 44 (permalink) Old March 25th, 2007, 19:36
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yes like said...we need to capitalize on Estonia...

my dream is having a repeat of the 1997 friendly with estonia..



ANYONE REMEMBER?!?!?!

7-0!!!!!!!!!!!!

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post #5 of 44 (permalink) Old March 26th, 2007, 00:27
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ירוק OLE!
you think we'll still play a 4-4-2, if we do then Kashtan is an idiot again. He needs to understand that we need goals now. This is a tight group and something tells me that the goal difference will really take effect in the end. We need to attack full force.
Kashtan won´t change his style of play. He is competent, but very stubborn.
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post #6 of 44 (permalink) Old March 26th, 2007, 00:32
ags
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how many people will be in attendance? Im guessing 15,000.
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post #7 of 44 (permalink) Old March 26th, 2007, 01:46
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Originally Posted by ags
how many people will be in attendance? Im guessing 15,000.
Maybe a bit more.
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post #8 of 44 (permalink) Old March 26th, 2007, 04:27
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20,000-25,000...
its the weekday......

its hard for people to stop and then go to a game all of a suden..kids have after school programs, you have a late night assignment, others have projects...its not something easy to do...

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post #9 of 44 (permalink) Old March 26th, 2007, 21:37
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Well gentleman, i´m beginning to get dissapointed on Kashtan´s mentality for the NT. What we heard last August was that Israel will have a great change, we would use younger players ( i don´t complain about this, but IMO they are not being well displayed) we would be offensive, we would qualify and so on. What we are actually seeing a NT that is still playing bunker style like Grant did, we are seeing a NT where our coach smiles and jumps after the match really happy with the draw while we play boring and if a bit more ambitious could´ve beaten the English. Now the players are assimilating this and now we hear from our best player lately Dudu Awat that a "1-0 against Estonia will please me". With all the respect to estonia if we want to qualify to euro we need to not only beat them, but convince our fans that we have good football. Their NT says a draw is a good result for them and we are here saying 1-0 will be enough. I´m sorry, but this is simply not a winning mentality we are building here. Hope this changes.
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post #10 of 44 (permalink) Old March 26th, 2007, 22:34
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Good news for you is that Estonian NT is in its worst crisis during this millenium when we come to face you in Wednesday. We haven't got a single point or scored a single goal in 4 matches and we just lost first time ever at home to our worst rival Russia. Our squad is in decline, low in confidence and we have a huge injury crisis at the moment with 3 of our best defenders and the best winger and striker all out as well as several other players.

So yeah, it would be quite a big surprise if we manage to get points from you in this match.

Big games are easy than the other games, unfortunately. Every times we have the control the games, under the control the games, during the games we had the some possibilities, some big chances, some big okazyons, something like that but what can I do, sometimes? And….it’s the football, that’s the football, something happened. Everything is something happened. - Fatih Terim
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post #11 of 44 (permalink) Old March 26th, 2007, 23:13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by berko
Well gentleman, i´m beginning to get dissapointed on Kashtan´s mentality for the NT. What we heard last August was that Israel will have a great change, we would use younger players ( i don´t complain about this, but IMO they are not being well displayed) we would be offensive, we would qualify and so on. What we are actually seeing a NT that is still playing bunker style like Grant did, we are seeing a NT where our coach smiles and jumps after the match really happy with the draw while we play boring and if a bit more ambitious could´ve beaten the English. Now the players are assimilating this and now we hear from our best player lately Dudu Awat that a "1-0 against Estonia will please me". With all the respect to estonia if we want to qualify to euro we need to not only beat them, but convince our fans that we have good football. Their NT says a draw is a good result for them and we are here saying 1-0 will be enough. I´m sorry, but this is simply not a winning mentality we are building here. Hope this changes.
You know...like i have been saying..and being ignored.... i'll say it again...no worries about it...
We have a bad chance than we did in the begining...

we got dominated on saturday...and yes..we can win at home on wedensday vs. Estonia..but look at it this way...
England had us in that game.....they were the top tier and we were failing infront of our crowd...

What makes this different from the last time was that our first WC Q game was against France in France and it was a tie...it was a bad game too, but atleast when they came to Israel, we gave them a fight...and we were better...

i am in fear and in denial to what will happen to us in September 2007. We will be crushed like mices in London and no one is seeing it. Kashtan can be happy until kingdoms come.... right now we have a strong team to play.... what does he expect? Another tie? Grant could have done the same vs. Slovenia, but didnt and we lost 2-0....

its over people.... :rollani:
3rd place as always.... im beginign to like it somehow.........

:rollani:
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post #12 of 44 (permalink) Old March 27th, 2007, 01:01 Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by berko
Well gentleman, i´m beginning to get dissapointed on Kashtan´s mentality for the NT. What we heard last August was that Israel will have a great change, we would use younger players ( i don´t complain about this, but IMO they are not being well displayed) we would be offensive, we would qualify and so on. What we are actually seeing a NT that is still playing bunker style like Grant did, we are seeing a NT where our coach smiles and jumps after the match really happy with the draw while we play boring and if a bit more ambitious could´ve beaten the English. Now the players are assimilating this and now we hear from our best player lately Dudu Awat that a "1-0 against Estonia will please me". With all the respect to estonia if we want to qualify to euro we need to not only beat them, but convince our fans that we have good football. Their NT says a draw is a good result for them and we are here saying 1-0 will be enough. I´m sorry, but this is simply not a winning mentality we are building here. Hope this changes.
I can't agree with you more. Kashtan is very disappointing. Against England we needed to play offensive because they were in horrible form. We need to totally kill Estonia. We need these goals and if Kashtan is trying to send the message that 1-0 is good through his players then he will also be fired once Luzon realizes that we won't qualify. Our chances are extremely slim since we didn't beat England at home. In England they will beat us, and thats a fact. We need to understand that a team like England will qualify no matter what, I can assure all of you that in the remaining games England will step it up and qualify. Teams like England, Spain, France, Germany, etc. always qualify for these things. To think that they won't is outrageous. I won't be pessimistic, but i'll be very direct, the odds of us qualifying are very low especially when we have to compete with Russia, England and Croatia while still having to deal with a country like Macedonia which can also beat us (from what I saw with the game against Croatia they have alot of talented players). Kashtan needs to change the game plan. Against RUssia he played nice attack and it worked very well, I hope he changes his game quickly.
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post #13 of 44 (permalink) Old March 27th, 2007, 01:07 Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by Kappa21
its over people.... :rollani:
3rd place as always.... im beginign to like it somehow.........
no my friend. You and I both know our NT has more potential then to stay in third and we alwyas prove that our football is "getting better" in small doses, but we never make a big enough mood to show everyone that we're a strong football country. It seems very typical to blame the manager and its not always the managers fault. But to see a guy like Benayoun play defense almost the entire second half is a sin. We needed to hold our defense and then push up with everyone. ITs impossible for 2 strikers to recieve a counter attack and take on all the english defensive midfielders, defenders, and keeper. Kashtan didn't play to win and its that type of technique (similar to Grant's) which will get us in that "almost" 3rd place...thats useless because now who remembers that we "almost" for the world cup? nobody! the only way we can be remembered is if we pull a suprise and qualify. ITs possible but we need a manager who isn't scared to gamble and take a full force attack. Its either we play full attack and qualify or completely get thrashed, or we can keep playing bunker and stay in that "almost" zone.
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post #14 of 44 (permalink) Old March 27th, 2007, 05:20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ירוק OLE!
ITs possible but we need a manager who isn't scared to gamble and take a full force attack. Its either we play full attack and qualify or completely get thrashed, or we can keep playing bunker and stay in that "almost" zone.

Well said.
I mean..honestly....

what will set us apart is this:

if we win maceodnian twice and tie croatia at home. Its simple to do..really..

look at it this way:
Russia loses to Croatia at both times.......
England tied macedonia...

so we have the edge maybe

:rollani:
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post #15 of 44 (permalink) Old March 27th, 2007, 05:41
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I think that 1-0 is a psychological effect...
stubborn team....depleted...down in confidence....
they need to hear something before they go psycho on us...

:rollani:
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post #16 of 44 (permalink) Old March 27th, 2007, 08:28
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KAPPA its beat macedonia not win macedonia, dont they teach u grammar in canada?

well in that case let me do it for you....
rule 1: u dont win teams, u BEAT teams, correct grammar would be "we should beat macedonia" or in another context, "hopefully we will win IN macedonia"

Kapish kappalle?
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post #17 of 44 (permalink) Old March 27th, 2007, 13:54
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Andy Christ
Good news for you is that Estonian NT is in its worst crisis during this millenium when we come to face you in Wednesday. We haven't got a single point or scored a single goal in 4 matches and we just lost first time ever at home to our worst rival Russia. Our squad is in decline, low in confidence and we have a huge injury crisis at the moment with 3 of our best defenders and the best winger and striker all out as well as several other players.

So yeah, it would be quite a big surprise if we manage to get points from you in this match.
Yes more reasons for us to get mad at our players when they say a 1-0 will be enough.

I agree with Gal when he says we need a more ambitious coach. i have nothing against Kashtan, but he is going against what he planned for the NT. Like Berkovic said after the England match, if the team had Sharf ( despite all his controversial statements) and players like Revivo and Berkovic himself, the same NT that beat Austria 5-0 we would probably beat the English last Saturday. I know we faced England a very powerful team, but still knowing all our potential and their poor form we failed.
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post #18 of 44 (permalink) Old March 27th, 2007, 18:02
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Hold on.....football is a results based game and our results are not bad at all. When we abandoned the style which has been doing well for us in the last two years and opened up against Croatia we conceded 4 goals. Yes its great to play attacking football but realistically this would have not worked against England for 90 minutes. Plus our most experienced forward Collauti was suspended. So yes I agree that we need to step up the speed of our counter attacks and be more productive in the last third but even on Saturday with a bit more patience we could have opened England up. Also, whatever Berkovich thinks, Austria 97 sucked big time compared to the current England team which has players that can hurt anyone. I think we are going to see the REAL Israel in the matches against Russia and Macedonia.
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post #19 of 44 (permalink) Old March 27th, 2007, 22:04
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Originally Posted by Ilan
Hold on.....football is a results based game and our results are not bad at all. When we abandoned the style which has been doing well for us in the last two years and opened up against Croatia we conceded 4 goals. Yes its great to play attacking football but realistically this would have not worked against England for 90 minutes. Plus our most experienced forward Collauti was suspended. So yes I agree that we need to step up the speed of our counter attacks and be more productive in the last third but even on Saturday with a bit more patience we could have opened England up. Also, whatever Berkovich thinks, Austria 97 sucked big time compared to the current England team which has players that can hurt anyone. I think we are going to see the REAL Israel in the matches against Russia and Macedonia.
Actually the game against Austria was in 1999 and they had a decent team that had played in France 98. It was their downfall, but they had respectable players. We simply trashed them back then. Nowadays results are more important and stay in history like you say, for example Holland had great teams in the 70´s but they aren´t remembered as winners. But in this particular case against England i believe if we played more offensively we would win, firstly, England´s attack has scored one goal in the last five games, second they lack command, third they were in high pressure, fourth we were playinh at home and we know how to make a hot atmosphere, fifth, if we played more offensively and not only in counterattacks they wouldn´t pressure us as much. Sixth, the team is build around Benayoun, in this formation he played too isolated and no one to serve. Seventh, Tamuz and Ben Shushan are forwards not wingers and they worried more on how to contain attacks then to create themselves, when they decided to create a chance they were dangerous ( Tamuz header after a cross from Ben Shushan) Eight, if we you have fear and think a draw would suit you good then you will never win. Nine, England were plagued with injuries. Ten, the other nine reasons were enough.

So here are the "ten commandments" on why and how we could have beaten England:smileani:
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post #20 of 44 (permalink) Old March 28th, 2007, 02:42 Thread Starter
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a nice quote from Kashtan "with the exception of England this will be our toughest home game." Is he serious? Surely estonia's NT surpasses that of Russia, Croatia and Macedonia! Especially when they lack 5 key players! I mean what were we thinking, that we'll just beat a weak NT which is missing players at our home so easily! We must be crazy to think that.

In a serious tone...what the hell is Kashtan pulling. He's trying to prepare people for a draw?!! Or is he expecting the worst? Well I'm sure the worst will happen if he doesn't play a proper formation against a team we must completely dominate and score plenty of goals against. Really hate to see this type of talk from players, and most importantly managers. Kashtan needs to go back to the old ways and take a risk. Perhaps the Israeli managers can't handle the pressure they handle from the IFA and they know what its like to have pressure from fans. This is why I say again that we need a foreign manager. One who may not know much about our players but after research will know who to invite and won't be afraid to take a full force attack.
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