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post #1 of 66 (permalink) Old June 23rd, 2006, 22:46 Thread Starter
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Missed a huge chance?

Having watched the world cup and group H in particular, I have reached several conclusions. The first, Israel is much better then several teams in the competition. Teams like Angola, Togo, Trinidad, Costa Rica....players in amateur clubs, players with no clubs at all. We could've had a nice world cup performance had we made Germany, and I am saying that because I heard some people saying crap that we'd be embarassed in the world cup. OK we're not that great but not that awful, let's not lie and fool ourselves, some teams are there because of their easy route and that's it.

Secondly, the two teams from our group, France and Switzerland. They hardly impressed anyone (especially France) to say the least. Swiss relied on their boring counter attack, France nearly choked against minnows, only last year we missed out a win in Basel thanks to our stupidity by not trying to score. I dare to say we could've made the 1/8 finals of the competition and maybe even beat Ukraine in there (we beat them last year and they aren't exactly world beaters as shown against Tunisia and Spain).

So am I crazy?

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post #2 of 66 (permalink) Old June 23rd, 2006, 22:53
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Its the same tale...
We had a chance in 2002...and we lost in the dying minutes...

did anyone promise us a win in Turkey?
or a win again in Turkey in 2006 qualifiers?

I think we are good, but we just cannot put the puzzle together and win...
Hopefully we will be a better side next time.....

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post #3 of 66 (permalink) Old June 24th, 2006, 06:25
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Raanan
Having watched the world cup and group H in particular, I have reached several conclusions. The first, Israel is much better then several teams in the competition. Teams like Angola, Togo, Trinidad, Costa Rica....players in amateur clubs, players with no clubs at all. We could've had a nice world cup performance had we made Germany, and I am saying that because I heard some people saying crap that we'd be embarassed in the world cup. OK we're not that great but not that awful, let's not lie and fool ourselves, some teams are there because of their easy route and that's it.

Secondly, the two teams from our group, France and Switzerland. They hardly impressed anyone (especially France) to say the least. Swiss relied on their boring counter attack, France nearly choked against minnows, only last year we missed out a win in Basel thanks to our stupidity by not trying to score. I dare to say we could've made the 1/8 finals of the competition and maybe even beat Ukraine in there (we beat them last year and they aren't exactly world beaters as shown against Tunisia and Spain).

So am I crazy?

your not crazy my friend, clearly if we were in the group that France and Switzerland had then i think we'd have a good shot at it. The french played like total crap and maybe we could have gotten a win from them, the swiss may play boring counter attack but they do it well and they win games. Togo and S. Korea are very much beatable teams. Israel did have a chance the only thing i think that would have stopped us is the Turkey qualification games. Turkey is a very good team, and they were jsut unlucky agains the swiss, and as Kappa says, i don't think we would have gotten through the Turks. Yet, other then that i don't see a reason why we couldn't make the 1/8 finals. Like Raanan says we are not that great, but we certainly aren't awaful. Its very true that some teams have a much easier route to the world cup then others, especially Israel which plays in Europe.
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post #4 of 66 (permalink) Old June 24th, 2006, 15:01
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Playing in Europe is a double edges sword, on the one hand its much harder to qualify, on the other hand playing regularly against top european sides has so dramatically improved the level of the game in Israel. Any side that qualifies from europe must automatically be taken seriously now. (Apart maybe from Poland, who always look good in qualifying and then seem to suck big time in tournaments.)
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post #5 of 66 (permalink) Old June 24th, 2006, 15:16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Raanan
Secondly, the two teams from our group, France and Switzerland. They hardly impressed anyone (especially France) to say the least. Swiss relied on their boring counter attack, France nearly choked against minnows, only last year we missed out a win in Basel thanks to our stupidity by not trying to score. I dare to say we could've made the 1/8 finals of the competition and maybe even beat Ukraine in there (we beat them last year and they aren't exactly world beaters as shown against Tunisia and Spain).

So am I crazy?
yeah but would we beat turkey in the relegation game ? i don't think so !
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post #6 of 66 (permalink) Old June 24th, 2006, 18:15
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Turkey is hard to beat, but can be beaten

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post #7 of 66 (permalink) Old June 24th, 2006, 18:18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ilan
Playing in Europe is a double edges sword, on the one hand its much harder to qualify, on the other hand playing regularly against top european sides has so dramatically improved the level of the game in Israel. Any side that qualifies from europe must automatically be taken seriously now. (Apart maybe from Poland, who always look good in qualifying and then seem to suck big time in tournaments.)

Exactly! We could never improve while playing in Oceania against teams like Guam, Samoa and Fiji. Our fans will just have to have a lot of patience though because qualifying in UEFA groups is always going to be difficult. Take a national team like Finland for example. Over the last generation they have players like Litmanen, Hyypia, Forsell, and great goalkeepers such as Jääskeläinen and Antti Niemi. All of these players are better than anyone we have. So which world cup has Finland played in? Seriously I am not sure if they have ever been there. Certainly not recently. Just goes to show that even an "easy" UEFA group is really not easy. BTW I agree that we would not have beaten Turkey in the playoff. The Swiss get a lot of credit for that IMHO.

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post #8 of 66 (permalink) Old June 25th, 2006, 00:13
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yea turkey would be very hard, and this is why you have to respect the swiss, they had alot of heart and they even proved it now in Germany. They want to make something happen and you have to respect them for that, because its not like they have a big named squad with talents. They just have a couple of young players who never want to lose.

As for what Ilan says about Europe. Its very true, in a couple of years we'll progress. If we were playing in Asia then i don't see us getting much better and even if we did make the WC in a different continent then how long would we last? The way i see it, Europe really prepares you for the WC and like Ilan says, most of the teams that qualify from europe are never underestimated because if you can make it there then you have a shot at achieving something.
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post #9 of 66 (permalink) Old June 25th, 2006, 01:18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ירוק OLE!
yea turkey would be very hard, and this is why you have to respect the swiss, they had alot of heart and they even proved it now in Germany. They want to make something happen and you have to respect them for that, because its not like they have a big named squad with talents. They just have a couple of young players who never want to lose.
You gotta respect the swiss. They have been really good ever since Euro 2004. They made it in, in a hard group. They are a team unlike they're neighbours in the East...Austria who have been up our thraots for 2 qualifications in 2000 and 2002.

Quote:
As for what Ilan says about Europe. Its very true, in a couple of years we'll progress. If we were playing in Asia then i don't see us getting much better and even if we did make the WC in a different continent then how long would we last? The way i see it, Europe really prepares you for the WC and like Ilan says, most of the teams that qualify from europe are never underestimated because if you can make it there then you have a shot at achieving something.
Europe is good, because you have a majority of WC teams in it. But you see that South America is good. So is Cental America. Africa is good too and the far east asia had put up a few fights.....
so soccer is different.

But i do agree nonetheless..the fans would not come if we played Israel vs. S. Korea.... just not intrested

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post #10 of 66 (permalink) Old June 26th, 2006, 00:57
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Well the swiss deserve a lot of credit on their campaign. Maybe it os not an attractive football, but certainly an efficient one. They have the necessary cold blood that we lack in the decisive moments. That is the difference. In Ramat Gan we could've beaten them as we played better, but we weren't able to conclude well despite having Benayoun in an inspired evening scoring two incredible goals. Against Turkey in the playoffs, Switzerland played just right and used the advantage built in the first match, since it isn't easy to play in Istanbul. Let's see if in the next campaign we could go through, i believe we have conditions to do so.
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post #11 of 66 (permalink) Old June 26th, 2006, 04:59
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Yea.
im not looking in the past...
since 2000 we had really awsome chances to get in to the WC/EURO's compared to the last decade where 3rd place usually is the best spot for us.... let alone last or 2nd last....

With the exception of Euro 2004 qualifiers..we had a great chance in WC 2002 Q and also in this one... only goals were the problem.

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post #12 of 66 (permalink) Old July 5th, 2006, 09:49
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Quote:
Originally Posted by berko
Well the swiss deserve a lot of credit on their campaign. Maybe it os not an attractive football, but certainly an efficient one. They have the necessary cold blood that we lack in the decisive moments. That is the difference. In Ramat Gan we could've beaten them as we played better, but we weren't able to conclude well despite having Benayoun in an inspired evening scoring two incredible goals. Against Turkey in the playoffs, Switzerland played just right and used the advantage built in the first match, since it isn't easy to play in Istanbul. Let's see if in the next campaign we could go through, i believe we have conditions to do so.
we deserve just as much credit as the swiss, we finished with the same results in all the games 4 wins and 6 draws

if pini balili had any sense of finishing we would have beaten switzerland easily at ramat gan

lets not for a st jakobs stadium when those palestinian protesters came on to the field and it took the swiss 10 minutes to get them off
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post #13 of 66 (permalink) Old July 5th, 2006, 15:17
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Originally Posted by eli225
we deserve just as much credit as the swiss, we finished with the same results in all the games 4 wins and 6 draws

if pini balili had any sense of finishing we would have beaten switzerland easily at ramat gan

lets not for a st jakobs stadium when those palestinian protesters came on to the field and it took the swiss 10 minutes to get them off
Of course we played better than Switzerland in Ramat Gan and that game at the end would make the difference. But what i meant was that it doesn't take their merit in the campaign aswell. They left the WC without conceding goals.
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post #14 of 66 (permalink) Old July 5th, 2006, 19:44
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Originally Posted by eli225
we deserve just as much credit as the swiss, we finished with the same results in all the games 4 wins and 6 draws

if pini balili had any sense of finishing we would have beaten switzerland easily at ramat gan

lets not for a st jakobs stadium when those palestinian protesters came on to the field and it took the swiss 10 minutes to get them off
there is no doubt we played beyond anyone's expectations, but i still give the Swiss credit, i could care less about the protesters since it has nothing to do with the Swiss NT. They played well, and i don't think Israel would have been able to get through Turkey if we were to take the Swiss' second place position. I give them respect also because they aren't too different then us. They have one or two fairly known players but thats it, and with that type of squad they got fairly far and almost got through the Ukrainians.
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post #15 of 66 (permalink) Old July 5th, 2006, 22:48
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Quote:
Originally Posted by eli225
we deserve just as much credit as the swiss, we finished with the same results in all the games 4 wins and 6 draws

if pini balili had any sense of finishing we would have beaten switzerland easily at ramat gan

lets not for a st jakobs stadium when those palestinian protesters came on to the field and it took the swiss 10 minutes to get them off

Marks should ahve clearly been deducated.
But with or without the game..dont u see..

we had everything going our way..
an easy 6 points from faroe islands and we just had to wait for the French outcome...
if only the french kept that 1-0 lead, we would have been in..

but who promised Israel a win in Turkey?

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post #16 of 66 (permalink) Old July 11th, 2006, 19:51
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mideast Mirage
Exactly! We could never improve while playing in Oceania against teams like Guam, Samoa and Fiji. Our fans will just have to have a lot of patience though because qualifying in UEFA groups is always going to be difficult. Take a national team like Finland for example. Over the last generation they have players like Litmanen, Hyypia, Forsell, and great goalkeepers such as Jääskeläinen and Antti Niemi. All of these players are better than anyone we have. So which world cup has Finland played in? Seriously I am not sure if they have ever been there. Certainly not recently. Just goes to show that even an "easy" UEFA group is really not easy. BTW I agree that we would not have beaten Turkey in the playoff. The Swiss get a lot of credit for that IMHO.
We been playing in Europe for about 14 years now, and I don' think we saw a satisfactory results yet.
IMO our football system needs to be revolutionized. The IFA is manged in an armature fashion, and so does the most players attitude.
Our achievements so far comes from a single talents, and not from a organized system.
If we do manage to qualify to some tournament, it will be by chance, if the system won't be reformed

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post #17 of 66 (permalink) Old July 11th, 2006, 20:05
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Nah, I think you're crazy. All the European teams there were much better then Israel, and the only teams not better then Israel there maybe would of been...Well I would of said Angola and Trinidad but they impressed me with how they played, so I think every team there was better. Plus not including the European teams who made it, you have the European teams better than Israel who didn't make it ; Denmark, Norway, Romania, Greece, Turkey, and etc .

I would put Israel at about the same level as Belarus, Albania, or Lithuania.

Last edited by True-Kozak; July 11th, 2006 at 20:15.
post #18 of 66 (permalink) Old July 11th, 2006, 20:40
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Originally Posted by True-Kozak
Nah, I think you're crazy. All the European teams there were much better then Israel, and the only teams not better then Israel there maybe would of been...Well I would of said Angola and Trinidad but they impressed me with how they played, so I think every team there was better. Plus not including the European teams who made it, you have the European teams better than Israel who didn't make it ; Denmark, Norway, Romania, Greece, Turkey, and etc .

I would put Israel at about the same level as Belarus, Albania, or Lithuania.

Dont forget the blabber mouthing Ukrainians who has only 1 star and the rest of the team in nowheres land....

least we can tie Spain...
and not lose to them by such a heavy amount...

if you put us with Belarus and Lithuania..both were beaten by Israel..
i suggest you put your Ukrainians as well, since last summer we did the same to you

pity the foo'

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post #19 of 66 (permalink) Old July 11th, 2006, 20:50
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Originally Posted by True-Kozak
Nah, I think you're crazy. All the European teams there were much better then Israel, and the only teams not better then Israel there maybe would of been...Well I would of said Angola and Trinidad but they impressed me with how they played, so I think every team there was better. Plus not including the European teams who made it, you have the European teams better than Israel who didn't make it ; Denmark, Norway, Romania, Greece, Turkey, and etc .

I would put Israel at about the same level as Belarus, Albania, or Lithuania.
the fact that you'd put israel with belarus, albania, and lituania is pathetic

i dont know if this is a political problem you have

but if you arent aware that israel finished an unbeaten campaign
in a mucher tougher group than ukraine was in not including tying at stade de france and coming back from 0-2 down lansdowne road

we were the first team to score in ireland in two years

thats completely wrong

if you think costa rica is better than israel something is seriously wrong

and if i recall last august israel beating ukraine in ukraine without out best player yossi benayoun

these are the teams israel are better than in the world cup

angola
iran
trinidad and tobago
ukraine
costa rica
switzerland - debatable
saudi arabia
tunisia
togo
poland - debatable
serbia and montenegro - debatable

if you think every team in the world cup is better than israel something is seriously wrong with you bud

and i'd take an IQ test just to be sure that u arent completely nuts

בן כלב
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post #20 of 66 (permalink) Old July 11th, 2006, 21:28
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Quote:
Originally Posted by eli225

if you think every team in the world cup is better than israel something is seriously wrong with you bud

and i'd take an IQ test just to be sure that u arent completely nuts

בן כלב
What's with the harsh reaction?

You think Israeli football is well known in Europe?
Maybe all he knows is from the results the NT got? In that case we are not much different from Belarus and Lithuania

You just jumped like an arse and brought politics into it and started to insult him just because he gave his opinion

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