Did Katan flop? - Xtratime Community
 
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post #1 of 18 (permalink) Old May 14th, 2006, 22:56 Thread Starter
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Did Katan flop?

After his move to West Ham there were talks even from Pardew himself about Yaniv and Yossi playing together. But fact is, Yaniv Katan has never really made it in West Ham. A few appearances as a substitute, one start in a meaningless game with depleted squad...Benayoun today said he thinks Pardew wasn't fair and that Katan didn't get a chance to show his worth. Is it true, or did Katan simply choke?

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post #2 of 18 (permalink) Old May 14th, 2006, 23:53
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You could say that he wasn't given a fair chance. But I also think that in England it is very different. Some players are given 5 minutes on the pitch and after that, and only that, does the manager decide if the player will be staying or leaving. Things move quick in that area, and don't forget that he takes a foreign spot. West Ham are playing the UEFA Cup next season and Pardew might want a foreigner from South America or Africa
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post #3 of 18 (permalink) Old May 15th, 2006, 00:16
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I believe it was a bit of both. katan didn´t receive enough minutes of play and sequence to show his full potential, but he also seemed very nervous and tense to play. He didn´t feel so confortable over there. Maybe coming back to Maccabi haifa will be better.
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post #4 of 18 (permalink) Old May 15th, 2006, 00:24
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I think he should stay. His situation reminds me a bit of the Borgetti one. He was also on the bench and only played in Carling Cup matches. During the season he has adapted to the league and has slowly partly established himself in the team after the winterbreak.
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post #5 of 18 (permalink) Old May 15th, 2006, 00:57
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The Problem with Katan is that he is a good player. He is too good for the Israeli Leauge, but he isnt as good enough for the EPL.

His move was made on behalf of agents and there mouths and not his actions. I think a team in a lower division would have suited him or possibly a move to the Austrian/Swiss or Turkish leauge.

He took things too fast IMO and he was talk. Then again, i think they should have given him a chance, but in the end, nothing was really shown...and this is why he got spit out of West Ham...
more or less how Illan Bachar and Omri Afek got spitted out in R. Santander

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post #6 of 18 (permalink) Old May 15th, 2006, 01:12
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How good is he compared to Balili?? Because that guy is doing well in the turkish league.
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post #7 of 18 (permalink) Old May 15th, 2006, 01:14
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I agree with Kappa, but I don't think he should be in Switzerland or Austria, more like a mid table team in Italy, Spain or France. Don't forget that the British football is very very different. Its alot faster and less technical, and that is not the type of game Katan belongs in. Yossi may not be up for the long balls but he makes up for it with an enormous amount of talent, and skill with dribbling. Yossi also established a name in Spain and lots of people at West Ham were looking foward to him. Katan's signing wasn't really heard of so much.
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post #8 of 18 (permalink) Old May 15th, 2006, 18:02
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Originally Posted by Starcraft
How good is he compared to Balili?? Because that guy is doing well in the turkish league.
They have different styles. Balili is a speedy player, a typical counter attack forward. Katan is a stronger and technical player. In Israel, Katan is better rated than Balili.
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post #9 of 18 (permalink) Old May 15th, 2006, 19:17
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the reason katan didnt have any success in west ham is since he does not fit the european style football, its a lot more pacey and requires much more athletic abilities. the league in israel is a slow-paced league and that is because players with techniques and no athleticism are preferred over players with less technique and a lot of athleticism, which is the opposite in england. you could see katan playing for the national team against france, ireland, and switzerland, he did absolutely nothing on offense. bottom line, he just does not fit the european system.
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post #10 of 18 (permalink) Old May 15th, 2006, 21:31
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ירוק OLE!
I agree with Kappa, but I don't think he should be in Switzerland or Austria, more like a mid table team in Italy, Spain or France. Don't forget that the British football is very very different. Its alot faster and less technical, and that is not the type of game Katan belongs in. Yossi may not be up for the long balls but he makes up for it with an enormous amount of talent, and skill with dribbling. Yossi also established a name in Spain and lots of people at West Ham were looking foward to him. Katan's signing wasn't really heard of so much.
He would have done good in a team like portsmouth

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post #11 of 18 (permalink) Old May 15th, 2006, 22:58
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Originally Posted by Kappa21
He would have done good in a team like portsmouth
possiblly but i disagree with anyone who says he wasn't ready for Europe. I think that we generalize too much, Europe has different level and England has the quickest pace without a doubt. I think that a mid table spanish or italian team would fit him. England is all about long ball, fast pace, and it requires alot alot alot of physical fitness. I hope he doesn't give up on Europe .
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post #12 of 18 (permalink) Old May 15th, 2006, 23:45
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Originally Posted by ירוק OLE!
possiblly but i disagree with anyone who says he wasn't ready for Europe. I think that we generalize too much, Europe has different level and England has the quickest pace without a doubt. I think that a mid table spanish or italian team would fit him. England is all about long ball, fast pace, and it requires alot alot alot of physical fitness. I hope he doesn't give up on Europe .
That is why we should put Benayoun in a different level. In his first season in England he already made success and also played brilliantly without losing his style and touch. He was even selected in the best 11 of the league. His period in Spain contributed a lot for this. Katan went straight from Israel to England, Benayoun still had Spain as a country to give him more experience. Katan would do better in Spain or Italy, but now maybe for next season he gets more used to it.
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post #13 of 18 (permalink) Old May 15th, 2006, 23:48
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He could go to Germany. That is a pretty slow paced league.
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post #14 of 18 (permalink) Old May 16th, 2006, 21:42 Thread Starter
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Katan has arrived. He claims he isn't getting the chances he needs, and he'd like to play at Haifa again if things don't change at West Ham.

But Mr. Money in the bank Arkady Gaidamak declared Beitar is doing a big effort to sign Katan. We're negotiating with the Hammers and Arkady is willing to splash more then 600K/a year on wages for Yaniv.

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post #15 of 18 (permalink) Old May 17th, 2006, 16:48
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He is an extremely talented player who I think could have been great if he had solid instructions and schooling in a professional youth academy when he was a youngster. Unfortunetly in Israel every amateur knows better and professional coaching even in the Israeli Premierleague IMO is very rare. So on his day Katan can be fantastic and score against Manure in the Championsleague - but as soon as there is work to do on the pitch like inteligent running, knowing when to tackle and when to track back - stuff you have to learn from good coaches at youth level - he disappears. He had some promising spells from the bench but against Portsmouth when he was given a start he was awful, his running was like that of a kid playing on the schoolyard, sorry.

Perhaps a loan spell with Peter Taylors team might help him to settle in - but I doubt it. As long as coaching doesn't improve in Israel I'm afraid that only the really exceptional players like Benayoun, Berkovic and Revivo have a chance to succeed in the top European leagues.

It a shame really, because we have so much talent.
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post #16 of 18 (permalink) Old May 17th, 2006, 17:04
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Originally Posted by Ariksan
He is an extremely talented player who I think could have been great if he had solid instructions and schooling in a professional youth academy when he was a youngster. Unfortunetly in Israel every amateur knows better and professional coaching even in the Israeli Premierleague IMO is very rare. So on his day Katan can be fantastic and score against Manure in the Championsleague - but as soon as there is work to do on the pitch like inteligent running, knowing when to tackle and when to track back - stuff you have to learn from good coaches at youth level - he disappears. He had some promising spells from the bench but against Portsmouth when he was given a start he was awful, his running was like that of a kid playing on the schoolyard, sorry.

Perhaps a loan spell with Peter Taylors team might help him to settle in - but I doubt it. As long as coaching doesn't improve in Israel I'm afraid that only the really exceptional players like Benayoun, Berkovic and Revivo have a chance to succeed in the top European leagues.

It a shame really, because we have so much talent.
That is very true. We have quality players, that could succeed abroad. We just need to be more professional and put more discipline in the youth systems and this will make the players be ready. Like you said, only players that were excepcional succeeded, like Berkovic, Revivo and now Benayoun.
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post #17 of 18 (permalink) Old May 18th, 2006, 19:20
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the biggest problem here is that the youth clubs dont focus on physical abillities and athleticism. when some kid knows how to dribble and juggle the ball in the air while running, the coaches get impressed and thats wrong since in a game you wouldnt do that, young players need to be tought how to be physically fit, a thing which isnt being tought well enough here in our youth systems...
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post #18 of 18 (permalink) Old May 25th, 2006, 17:41
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Perhaps Katan's game is not on the EPL level, but it also has to be remembered that West Ham signed Dean Ashton a few weeks after Yaniv. We had a glut of strikers this past season, with Deano, Harewood, Zamora & even the ageless wonder Teddy Sheringham ahead of him, it's no wonder Katan barely got a few minutes on the pitch.

Either way best of luck to the lad, he can now always say he wore the Hammers shirt

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