Interesting history on race....... - Page 3 - Xtratime Community
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post #41 of 295 (permalink) Old May 2nd, 2001, 21:37
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A great-great uncle on my mothers' side of the family was active in the Underground Railroad in the 1860's, the clandestine effort to help escaped slaves travel from bondage to relative freedom in the North. His home near the New York/Pennsylvania border served as a safe house before the last leg to liberation. He did this at grave risk to his life and livelihood, SLB, because he knew in his heart and soul that enslaving other human beings was a moral outrage. His name was Thomas Hovendon, if you'd like to check the facts. History has a human face. Love of your fellow man is a timeless concept.

[Edited by Freddie on 02-05-2001 at 22:39]
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post #42 of 295 (permalink) Old May 2nd, 2001, 21:50
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However I completely disagree with you that racism is a by product of racism and ignorance. Fear of other races, why exactly?!?! Ignorant of other races?!?! 60/70 years ago evryone knew that africans had a diffirent culture like they do today. Racism in my opinion is just an ideology.


Yes, people realized africans had cultures, but they were not seen as equal in importance, but rather simply backward and uncivilized. Africans weren't seen as so much as different, but rather not yet to the point that Europe was.

Heck, you see the same thing today. African american culture, language and customs are not seen so much as a seperate culture but rather as things blacks don't do correctly.

Racism is a mentality. I don't know if that is an ideology or not. It's born from the ignorant belief that one group is superior to another. I've found that the vast majority of racist/prejudiced people I've come across (and I'm in the South, so that's a lot) know little to nothing about black people or mexicans or asians etc. All they know is they are different (duh) and that those differences are somehow not as good as whites. It's a very subtle transfer of difference to inferiority, but it's fairly common. So called white culture is deemed the norm, and thus correct, and black culture is seen as backward since they "talk funny" or do whatever else it is white people think "minorities" do. So, racism is a direct cousin to ignorance, if not it's twin brother.

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post #43 of 295 (permalink) Old May 2nd, 2001, 22:14
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Well said, Dae. However, what leads to the hatred is the element of fear. Fear and ignorance, collectively, is what leads to the hatred of a specific race/culture/ethnicity... thus- racism.

Freedom is the great liberator of the mind it threatens only the comfort of the sequacious intellect.

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post #44 of 295 (permalink) Old May 2nd, 2001, 22:48
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Sure. That which we do not understand will often scare us. That's not necessarily the "scary ghost" type of fear, but the uneasiness born of not exactly knowing what somebody else is thinking or what they'll do.

I find the "typical" white person around Tally has no idea what black people think, so they assume that whatever black person they see if watching them, thinking about them etc.. It's really pretty silly. I've been with my sister-in-law and she's gotten scared because there happen to be a few black people around. It creates instant fear because she doesn't understand them and figures they might "get her" simply because she thinks that's what they do. You know, "gotta get whitey". It sounds almost absurd, and it is, but it is also very true.

The thing is black people have to deal with whites whether they want to or not. It's a "white world" after all. So, they pretty much understand how white people think and act. However, a white person (of even modest means) could potentially go days, weeks or even months without interacting with a black person in any significant way. It's impossible to understand someone or something without some sustained contact.

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post #45 of 295 (permalink) Old May 4th, 2001, 14:24
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All I see here are opinions> I found the article to be an interesting read, regardless of the authors itentions or motives. I for one am gald that SLB posted it, though there should be a forum for such OT hot topics.

You guys can go on about racism, bigotry & the like, but the way I see it, its just someones opinion, be it wrong or right - where all entitled to one. Like everything you'll read these days there usually a mix of fact & fiction.

I dont see what the big deal is with the article; to compare it to child pornography is a gross overstatement.
post #46 of 295 (permalink) Old May 4th, 2001, 14:45
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Quote:
Originally posted by O Glorioso


I dont see what the big deal is with the article; to compare it to child pornography is a gross overstatement.

Very true. And also true that the article is mostly opinion or one man's view on a subject. However, it is a racist view point and on that you really can't debate. As soon as you begin blaming a group for the decay of society and speaking out against the marriage/mingling of races, you are talking about racism. Whether on one happens to agree or disagree is a personal matter.

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post #47 of 295 (permalink) Old May 4th, 2001, 19:09 Thread Starter
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Thank you OG, at last some rationality.

As for racism being due to ignorance. I still think it is down to ideology of one race proclaiming itself to be better than others or dislike of others. Yes they may be scared or ignorant of the other race but there can also be much simpler explanations like they don't like the colour. Take Hitler's volksgemeinschaft. Hitler's aim was to create a 'pure' arian race. However I don't think he was scared of any other race, God he himself wasn't even of arian race, just an ideology that Hitler had, a harmful and wicked ideology yes, nevertheless I still think it can be put down to ideolgy.





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post #48 of 295 (permalink) Old May 4th, 2001, 19:22
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I think Hitler was terrified of Jews. To him, they were the cause of all evil. Paranoia like that has to be terrifying.

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post #49 of 295 (permalink) Old May 4th, 2001, 19:25
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Oh, the "ignorance" we talk about is the thought that one race is somehow more great or worthy than another. Such beliefs are not based on anything of substance and are thus ignorant.

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post #50 of 295 (permalink) Old May 4th, 2001, 19:45
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It comes down to understanding psychology. All ideology is a manifestation of basic human emotions. Fear, by far, being most often the most dominating and motivator of our emotions. Again, we fear mostly the unknown, thus respond to a perceived threat by attempting to destroy that threat.

Hitler was convinced the other races were a threat to his his moral and social ideals. He was convinced that the hardships that plagued the once great and proud Germanic kingdom were a direct result of the dilution of the German society from the Jewish migration to Germany. It was this fear that motivated his ideology to rid the planet of these undesirables(in his view).

Ignorance is what led to the blaming the economic hardships on the Jews, where in actuality, the Jewish business men were the only ones driving what little remained of the economy.

Then, add resentment to the equation and what you get is a paranoid to the extreme of Hitler.

You can call it an ideology. But, as I said earlier, it is motivated by these basic emotions.

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post #51 of 295 (permalink) Old May 4th, 2001, 20:53
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To any and all... define 'race' for me. What are the 'races'? What 'race' are you.

Here is what Merriam-Webster's dictionary says...

Main Entry: race
Function: noun
Etymology: Middle French, generation, from Old Italian razza
Date: 1580
1 : a breeding stock of animals

2 a : a family, tribe, people, or nation belonging to the same stock b : a class or kind of people unified by community of interests, habits, or characteristics <the English race>

3 a : an actually or potentially interbreeding group within a species; also : a taxonomic category (as a subspecies) representing such a group b : BREED c : a division of mankind possessing traits that are transmissible by descent and sufficient to characterize it as a distinct human type
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post #52 of 295 (permalink) Old May 4th, 2001, 21:12
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The only thing I know for sure is that I am a member of the living, as opposed to the non-living. At least temporarily.

[Edited by Pila on 04-05-2001 at 22:15]

Freedom is the great liberator of the mind it threatens only the comfort of the sequacious intellect.

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post #53 of 295 (permalink) Old May 5th, 2001, 01:25
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I am of the: Celtic, Lusotanian, Visogothic, Flemish, Phonecian, Moorish, Roman (Italian, Greek), Spanish, Cartheginian, and of black African ancestry...I am PORTUGUESE!
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post #54 of 295 (permalink) Old May 5th, 2001, 02:44
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And I am of Irish, Scottish, English, Mexican, Romanian, Czeck, Spanish and Native American ancestry...........and I'm American


Point is, nobody is pure anything and pretending we are is just racist bullsh*t.

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post #55 of 295 (permalink) Old May 5th, 2001, 03:37
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Quote:
Originally posted by daeone
Point is, nobody is pure anything and pretending we are is just racist bullsh*t.
What do u mean by this?

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post #56 of 295 (permalink) Old May 5th, 2001, 03:58
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Exactly what I said. If you go back far enough in your history, everybody will find that they are a creation of a multitude of cultures. Nothing is "pure" anything and pretending we are is just stupid. We should celebrate the fact that we are the result of many cultures. I take great offense to people who talk about how they are "pure" whatever and then talk as if everybody else is less than that. Nobody here has said that, but I am talking in reference to the idiots who complain that the "mingling" of races/cultures is somehow a bad thing.

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post #57 of 295 (permalink) Old May 5th, 2001, 04:00
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I often say I am pure Portuguese. I admit I do have my predjudices, but I don't think calling myself a pure portugueser a rascist statement.

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post #58 of 295 (permalink) Old May 5th, 2001, 04:24
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I am a PORTUGUESE AUSTRALIAN & more importantly a BENFIQUISTA.
I believe being pure of heart is more important than being pure of race or bloodline; which as stated by Dae there is no such thing.

For example I have all Portuguese blood in me for as long as our family can date back; but Im sure that some long forgotten ancester must have derived from another naionality
post #59 of 295 (permalink) Old May 5th, 2001, 04:38
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Well actually i would prefer to not be 100% pure (I am predominately Celtic [Scottish & Irish heritage] but have 1/8th German in me also) from the point of view of genetics. If you look at pure breed dogs for example, many of them have problems that are genetic, whereas cross breed dogs have some of these problems eliminated

I don't know if this is the same as humans, but apparently i heard on the radio the other morning that Australians of anglo-saxon & anglo-celtic origin were far more prone to asthma that other races :eekani:
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post #60 of 295 (permalink) Old May 5th, 2001, 04:38
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In high school I was somewhat of an 'outsider'. I went to a high school in downtown Toronto that was 60% Asian (mostly Chinese), and 30% was European and 10% was other. The Asians hung with the Asians, the Europeans (Italians, Portuguese and Greeks) hung around with each other, you had the small black minority and then other (the 'hippies', that's what we called them).

I was in an 'Extended French' program and a good number of the students in our 'exclusive' program were Portuguese. Now there was always something I couldn't quite put my finger on but I've figured it out. While the Portuguese would never say they were 'rascist', they never quite blended with any of the other cultures except for the Italians and Greeks. Which is hardly 'blending'. Sure, they were in clubs with them, were on the same sports teams, etc...But what really became apparent to me was that no matter how much they acted 'cosmopolitan', they never really fooled me. I saw through the thin veil of rascism or predjudice that they wore. Sure, no one would ever say anything remotely rascist. But I figured out soon enough that ignoring the 'others' or pretending to be excepting was just as rascist as being blatantly open about predjudice.

I made it a point early on in my life to face my 'fears'. I mingled with the Black students, dated one of them for a couple months, had many chinese friends, dated an asian girl, etc...I made it a point to learn as much as I can from the other cultures. This is what learning is all about, so I thought.

I knew that the Portuguese crowd whom I still had ties to, thought I had a screw loose. Actually, these same people ran the yearbook and decided to put me in as "Most Cosmically Unaware" (they knew they couldn't get people to actually vote me as such). They couldn't understand why I dated everything under the sun. If the truth be told: I dumped a Portuguese gal who ran the yearbook for a Jamaican gal. I was also "Runner-up for the Best Looking".

So you think that I'm a cosmopolitan fella today huh? Not really. I'm just as Portuguese as the next guy. I can't even fake being white anymore. I'm way more Portuguese now than I was in high school. The older I get the more Portuguese I become. I dunno what it is. I still can't speak the language though.




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