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post #1 of 27 (permalink) Old November 14th, 2005, 17:55 Thread Starter
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Serbian Kings

Just browsing through the internet I found this interesting site http://www.wegm.com/coins/milutin.htm about Serbian Kings. Apperantly it says that King Stefan Uros II Milutin 1282-1321 was a child molester/pedophile, he married his fourth wife when he was in his 40's and she was only 11 :eekani: well I'll let you just look at the link yourselves.
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post #2 of 27 (permalink) Old November 14th, 2005, 18:01
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I bet I can find a site that claims that Jesus was a child molester too. Doesn't make it true, though. Is the view of the site that you mention supported by any respected historians?

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post #3 of 27 (permalink) Old November 14th, 2005, 19:24
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I'm assuming it's just another showing of his inferiority complex, but I really don't want to know.

This message is hidden because CroatTommy is on your ignore list.

:thmbup: :thmbup:

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post #4 of 27 (permalink) Old November 14th, 2005, 19:39
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What's the point of this thread? This will obviously just start another fight. Maybe you shouldn't post any more threads about Serbia CroatTommy.
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post #5 of 27 (permalink) Old November 14th, 2005, 20:38
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Croattommy,

#1 - Marriage had to be consumated in those times to prevent complications later on. If you knew anything about history you would know strategic marriages were made to consolidate power between kingdoms and families and that these marriages had to be consummated. In fact, King Henry VIII of England was able to annul his marriage to Catherine of Aragon, based on the argument that they did not consummate their marriage. This eventually led to the Henry marrying Anne Boleyn and splitting England from church in Rome (there is much more to this, long story).

#2 - A quick history lesson for you, since you always seem to be talking about the past.

Historians use primary sources such as eye-witness accounts, letters, diaries, speeches and census data or hard evidence such as art or archeological remains to gain insights on the past.

Secondary sources such as scholarly books, academic journals reflect on and give an interpretation on the primary sources listed above. A history text book for example isn't the "truth" about what happened in the past it simply shows what the author believes happened through his research of primary sources. A textbook would be useful as a primary source to judge the authors worldview and the general view of the past at time the book was written. For example I could use you posts on here as primary source to write a paper on your world view.

Furthermore you have to be very careful when working with any primary or secondary source as many are biased (such as your posts), mislead unintentionally or leave out very important pieces of information.

A random internet link is unacceptable in any academic institution and and no historian relies on such material.

As graduate student in History, I'm a little sick of reading your "history" lessons on here. You should really stop trying to pass off the garbage you post here as concrete evidence of the past as it is biased, and next to useless.
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post #6 of 27 (permalink) Old November 14th, 2005, 20:46
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Originally Posted by Roman2k
Croattommy,

#1 - Marriage had to be consumated in those times to prevent complications later on. If you knew anything about history you would know strategic marriages were made to consolidate power between kingdoms and families and that these marriages had to be consummated. In fact, King Henry VIII of England was able to annul his marriage to Catherine of Aragon, based on the argument that they did not consummate their marriage. This eventually led to the Henry marrying Anne Boleyn and splitting England from church in Rome (there is much more to this, long story).

#2 - A quick history lesson for you, since you always seem to be talking about the past.

Historians use primary sources such as eye-witness accounts, letters, diaries, speeches and census data or hard evidence such as art or archeological remains to gain insights on the past.

Secondary sources such as scholarly books, academic journals reflect on and give an interpretation on the primary sources listed above. A history text book for example isn't the "truth" about what happened in the past it simply shows what the author believes happened through his research of primary sources. A textbook would be useful as a primary source to judge the authors worldview and the general view of the past at time the book was written. For example I could use you posts on here as primary source to write a paper on your world view.

Furthermore you have to be very careful when working with any primary or secondary source as many are biased (such as your posts), mislead unintentionally or leave out very important pieces of information.

A random internet link is unacceptable in any academic institution and and no historian relies on such material.

As graduate student in History, I'm a little sick of reading your "history" lessons on here. You should really stop trying to pass off the garbage you post here as concrete evidence of the past as it is biased, and next to useless.


Bravo Roman.
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post #7 of 27 (permalink) Old November 14th, 2005, 21:06
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some people here will never learn it
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post #8 of 27 (permalink) Old November 14th, 2005, 22:40 Thread Starter
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Marriage had to be consumated in those times to prevent complications later on.
He couldn't wait a few years? lol

Quote:
In fact, King Henry VIII of England was able to annul his marriage to Catherine of Aragon, based on the argument that they did not consummate their marriage. This eventually led to the Henry marrying Anne Boleyn and splitting England from church in Rome (there is much more to this, long story).
Yes yes Serbs and English the same thing, we know.

Quote:
As graduate student in History, I'm a little sick of reading your "history" lessons on here. You should really stop trying to pass off the garbage you post here as concrete evidence of the past as it is biased, and next to useless.
I never said I was an expert on history(a vast topic), I just claim to know a bit more about Croatian history and our constant struggle for freedom, and if that involves portraying Serbs(oppressors of Croats and others in the area) in a bad light, then so be it. I don't think the site I posted the link to was anti-Serbian at all, and it definetly wasn't Croatian in origin that is why I found it intersting, if you didn't, then disprove it, I don't care.
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post #9 of 27 (permalink) Old November 14th, 2005, 23:03
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This message is hidden because CroatTommy is on your ignore list.





And whatever the hell CT was crapping on about, bravo Roman2k! :thmbup:

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post #10 of 27 (permalink) Old November 14th, 2005, 23:07
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Serbians marrying 11 year olds? no shock there, let me guess, did the guy have a big ass beard and and have ahuge cross on his chest
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post #11 of 27 (permalink) Old November 14th, 2005, 23:11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Roman2k
In fact, King Henry VIII of England was able to annul his marriage to Catherine of Aragon, based on the argument that they did not consummate their marriage. This eventually led to the Henry marrying Anne Boleyn and splitting England from church in Rome (there is much more to this, long story).
Whilst you're right about the rest of the consummation bit, you're wrong about this. Had Henry VIII and Catherine or Aragon never consummated their marriage, they would have had a rather boring 24 years together, and there would have been some nervous glances towards Ye Olde Milkman regarding the infant Mary.

Consummation did play a key role in the affair, but in a more indirect way. Henry VIII argued that he couldn't have been legally married to Catherine of Aragon, as she had previously been the wife of Henry's elder brother Arthur, who had since died. However, it was the Pope that argued that Catherine was never married to Arthur on the grounds that Catherine and Arthur had never consummated the marriage. If that was true (which it may have been), Catherine and Arthur were never legally married, so Henry couldn't have his marriage to Catherine annulled.

As it happens, Henry decided that the Pope's views were wrong (both on the matter of the marriage and on whether West Brom would stay up), gave him the old heave-ho, and got his best friend (coincidentally the Archbishop of Canterbury) to annul the marriage for him. Thus, Mary was a bastard, Lady Jane Grey was the rightful queen after Edward VI, the Stuarts never would have come to the throne, and the United Kingdom wouldn't exist today. ARGH!
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Yes yes Serbs and English the same thing, we know.
That's made up my mind. SERB-EE-AH! SERB-EE-AH!

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post #12 of 27 (permalink) Old November 14th, 2005, 23:17
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Originally Posted by red star forever
This message is hidden because CroatTommy is on your ignore list.





And whatever the hell CT was crapping on about, bravo Roman2k! :thmbup:
OK, we understood that the guy is in you ignore list, no need to post after every one of his posts in order to proclaim that fact yet again. Just ignore him.

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post #13 of 27 (permalink) Old November 14th, 2005, 23:20
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OK, we understood that the guy is in you ignore list, no need to post after every one of his posts in order to proclaim that fact yet again. Just ignore him.
I'm emphasizing the fact that an idiot like himself deserves no other reply and no other attention. Just like he is emphasizing his obsession with his superior eastern neighbours.

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post #14 of 27 (permalink) Old November 14th, 2005, 23:30
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Originally Posted by red star forever
I'm emphasizing the fact that an idiot like himself deserves no other reply and no other attention. Just like he is emphasizing his obsession with his superior eastern neighbours.
...in turn making yourself look like an idiot.....
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post #15 of 27 (permalink) Old November 14th, 2005, 23:39
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...in turn making yourself look like an idiot.....
No thanks. I have no intention of following your path.

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post #16 of 27 (permalink) Old November 14th, 2005, 23:43
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This is the 3rd anti Serb thread that Croat Tommy has started in a week.

Surely something must be done about this. Xtratime needs to show consistency.

Do something. This is getting beyond a joke.

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post #17 of 27 (permalink) Old November 14th, 2005, 23:45
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Roman2k
Croattommy,



As graduate student in History, I'm a little sick of reading your "history" lessons on here. You should really stop trying to pass off the garbage you post here as concrete evidence of the past as it is biased, and next to useless.
Thanks.

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post #18 of 27 (permalink) Old November 15th, 2005, 00:21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Roman2k
.

As graduate student in History, I'm a little sick of reading your "history" lessons on here. You should really stop trying to pass off the garbage you post here as concrete evidence of the past as it is biased, and next to useless.
Who are you and why do you think CroatTommy or anyone else cares that you think his informative posts are "garbage"?!!?

If you don't like it, don't read it and kindly post in a thread you have a clue about. Now run along...

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post #19 of 27 (permalink) Old November 15th, 2005, 00:23
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Originally Posted by Bastin
Whilst you're right about the rest of the consummation bit, you're wrong about this. Had Henry VIII and Catherine or Aragon never consummated their marriage, they would have had a rather boring 24 years together, and there would have been some nervous glances towards Ye Olde Milkman regarding the infant Mary.

Consummation did play a key role in the affair, but in a more indirect way. Henry VIII argued that he couldn't have been legally married to Catherine of Aragon, as she had previously been the wife of Henry's elder brother Arthur, who had since died. However, it was the Pope that argued that Catherine was never married to Arthur on the grounds that Catherine and Arthur had never consummated the marriage. If that was true (which it may have been), Catherine and Arthur were never legally married, so Henry couldn't have his marriage to Catherine annulled.

As it happens, Henry decided that the Pope's views were wrong (both on the matter of the marriage and on whether West Brom would stay up), gave him the old heave-ho, and got his best friend (coincidentally the Archbishop of Canterbury) to annul the marriage for him. Thus, Mary was a bastard, Lady Jane Grey was the rightful queen after Edward VI, the Stuarts never would have come to the throne, and the United Kingdom wouldn't exist today. ARGH!
That's made up my mind. SERB-EE-AH! SERB-EE-AH!
Thank you for clarifying. I briefly read about this a while ago while doing some reading on Sir Thomas More. He was against the divorce of Catherine, against Henry VIII's split from Rome and refused to support the Oath of Supremacy/Act of Succession. Regardless, I'm just proving a point, that consumation played an important in role confirming marriage in Medieval Europe.
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post #20 of 27 (permalink) Old November 15th, 2005, 00:30 Thread Starter
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This is the 3rd anti Serb thread that Croat Tommy has started in a week
I don't see how this is anti-Serb. The first thread was anti-Greater Serbia, and it clearly shows that, please read it, if you are not a Greater Serbian Cetnik, then you would not have been angered by it. The second thread was asking why the first was closed down(due to Cetnik provocations from the likes of rsf and Andrija who despite ignoring me replied to each of my posts ), and this final one is just to make you guys wonder who your leaders were(in this case child molester). If you guys find out that the site I posted has a Croatian bias or something anti-Serbian please let me know, as far as I know it doesn't(I could be wrong sometimes ) and please grow some thicker skin, you shouldn't let a historical no nothing like myself affect you this much
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