Can Milan escape relegation? - Xtratime Community
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post #1 of 38 (permalink) Old October 2nd, 2019, 10:11 Thread Starter
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Can Milan escape relegation?

they're 16th at the moment so it might get close

Big games are easy than the other games, unfortunately. Every times we have the control the games, under the control the games, during the games we had the some possibilities, some big chances, some big okazyons, something like that but what can I do, sometimes? And….it’s the football, that’s the football, something happened. Everything is something happened. - Fatih Terim
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post #2 of 38 (permalink) Old October 2nd, 2019, 11:35
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And to think you used to call yourself a Milanista lol.



My answer to your question is:


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post #3 of 38 (permalink) Old October 2nd, 2019, 12:21
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to be a fan of any team shoudn't prevent you from saying the truth. Milan is awful awful awful team at the moment and have the worst milan players i've ever seen. i won't be shocked to see them the 16th of fighting relegation this season
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post #4 of 38 (permalink) Old October 2nd, 2019, 12:40
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And to think you used to call yoursel a Milanista lol.



My answer to your question is:


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yeah, Andy is still a Milan and Leeds fan
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post #5 of 38 (permalink) Old October 2nd, 2019, 12:40
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They've been up and down a few times, elevator team of sorts, so who knows.

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post #6 of 38 (permalink) Old October 2nd, 2019, 12:49
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Milan will comfortably reach 60+ points at the end of the season whoever is the coach, Giampaolo or another.

Andy Christ is clearly trolling but a few supporters of Milan are seriously considering the chance that their club will go to serie B (because they do not have a clue) or they are simply behaving like the guy who has some kind of pleasure in threatening the other guys in the same group with the worst possible scenarios. I talk about pleasure but honestly is a kind of pleasure I never understood.

Anyway, back to Milan, the problem is mostly the quality of the team. The supporters who say: "we were one goal from the CL spot in the past season" forget that it was a scenario which became possible mostly thanks to Inter (almost) and Roma committing suicide and Lazio giving up completely near the end of the season. There are seasons, like the past one, in which 69 points are enough to get the CL spot, there are seasons like the one before, in which 72 are not enough.

During the summer there is no doubt that Inter were strengthened badly, Marotta's way, which means with top players coming from top clubs, such as Lukaku, Godin and the same Alexis Sanchez. What did Milan do? Their transfer campaign was very similar to one of Cairo's: Krunic (who was indeed a target of Torino), Bennacer, Duarte, Rafael Leao, Rebic and Theo Hernandez. Similarly, Inter hired a winning coach like Conte, while Milan hired a coach who had proved good in developing young players in order to sell them to top clubs. So, while the doomsayers talking about relegation are clearly clueless, there is no doubt that supporters of a top club like Milan might be pissed at realizing that their club behave like a sort of Torino (no offense to Torino, I could have said Sampdoria but in this season Sampdoria chose the different and risky way of saving money).
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post #7 of 38 (permalink) Old October 2nd, 2019, 13:10 Thread Starter
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Milan will comfortably reach 60+ points at the end of the season whoever is the coach, Giampaolo or another.
They have failed to get 60 points in 3 out of the last 6 seasons so it would be far from a sure thing even without this disastrous start of the season.

Big games are easy than the other games, unfortunately. Every times we have the control the games, under the control the games, during the games we had the some possibilities, some big chances, some big okazyons, something like that but what can I do, sometimes? And….it’s the football, that’s the football, something happened. Everything is something happened. - Fatih Terim
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post #8 of 38 (permalink) Old October 2nd, 2019, 15:13
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Settling for someone like Giampaolo was pretty much 100% due to past mistakes. No CL and coach's salary counts for FFP too. The problem lies in the continuity of the mistakes. Everyone in power, past and present, keeps vouching for the quality and necessity of Suso, Calhanoglu, etc. yet on the pitch they are clearly responsible and hamper offensive movement and make mistakes game after game. If one watches Milan games and sees their performance the only explanation left for these players keep getting minutes is "cultural". I mean I even read Italian writers too, not just Milan management, call Suso a champion. It is clearly a mindset issue at this point. I mean a general calcio mindset of coaches, managers not of the players themselves.
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post #9 of 38 (permalink) Old October 2nd, 2019, 19:04
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They have failed to get 60 points in 3 out of the last 6 seasons so it would be far from a sure thing even without this disastrous start of the season.
but 3 out of the last 3 seasons. No risk of relegation anyway.
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post #10 of 38 (permalink) Old October 2nd, 2019, 19:48
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While Giampaolo stays, Milan will very likely be between 10-16 position, based on the performances so far and how utterly clueless the guy has seemed in every visible aspect of his job. He'll probably leave Milan close to the relegation zone by the time he is sacked. Which is likely to be sooner rather than later.

Sure the players are mediocre and all, but this team is playing a million times worse than last season. Absolutely every player is doing worse. Results are also worse. The team just gave up in front of its own fans last game. All that is obviously on the coach. This guy fielded Borini as central midfielder in his debut ffs, along with four other players completely out of position and several more in roles that made their game ineffective.

You don't need Cristiano Ronaldo and De Ligt to prevent losing to a shitty Udinese without a single shot on goal, or from being humiliated at home by a mediocre Fiorentina. The squad is good enough for a 4-8 finish.

But yeah Milan fans who watch every game "do not have a clue".

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post #11 of 38 (permalink) Old October 2nd, 2019, 20:16 Thread Starter
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but 3 out of the last 3 seasons. No risk of relegation anyway.
even during those the average is only around 64 points and this +4pts has been offset by the bad start already...

relegation talk is of course in jest

but if they lose at Genoa over the weekend then they will indeed be in relegation zone

Big games are easy than the other games, unfortunately. Every times we have the control the games, under the control the games, during the games we had the some possibilities, some big chances, some big okazyons, something like that but what can I do, sometimes? And….it’s the football, that’s the football, something happened. Everything is something happened. - Fatih Terim
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post #12 of 38 (permalink) Old October 2nd, 2019, 22:39
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Milan has the quality for 8-10 finish...
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post #13 of 38 (permalink) Old October 2nd, 2019, 22:41
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While Giampaolo stays, Milan will very likely be between 10-16 position, based on the performances so far and how utterly clueless the guy has seemed in every visible aspect of his job. He'll probably leave Milan close to the relegation zone by the time he is sacked. Which is likely to be sooner rather than later.

Sure the players are mediocre and all, but this team is playing a million times worse than last season. Absolutely every player is doing worse. Results are also worse. The team just gave up in front of its own fans last game. All that is obviously on the coach. This guy fielded Borini as central midfielder in his debut ffs, along with four other players completely out of position and several more in roles that made their game ineffective.

You don't need Cristiano Ronaldo and De Ligt to prevent losing to a shitty Udinese without a single shot on goal, or from being humiliated at home by a mediocre Fiorentina. The squad is good enough for a 4-8 finish.

But yeah Milan fans who watch every game "do not have a clue".
If Giampaolo is sacked soon Milan will obviously be 10-16, if he is kept till the end of the season it is highly unlikely that it will happen.
The squad is good enough for a 4-8 finish? You mean that it is good for a CL spot if Roma and Lazio choke, clearly. Without forgetting Atalanta... Milan is pretty much as good or as bad as it was one season ago so if Giampaolo after 38 games gains 68 points he has done what one would expect from him with this team. If you sack him now you will never know, maybe you prefer it that way!
And yeah, watching games doesn't automatically give a clue. It is odd that people who think coaches are clueless pretend that any supporter who watches the games has a clue!
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post #14 of 38 (permalink) Old October 2nd, 2019, 23:02
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even during those the average is only around 64 points and this +4pts has been offset by the bad start already...

relegation talk is of course in jest

but if they lose at Genoa over the weekend then they will indeed be in relegation zone
In 2015/2016 Juventus had 5 points after 6 games and they won the scudetto nevertheless. Allegri had already been sacked by 99% of supporters of course, but it's a thing which had already happened before and it happened later, whenever he didn't win.
One year later, in his first season at Sampdoria, Giampaolo had 6 points after 6 games and was very close to be sacked, or at least 99% of supporters wanted him sacked (me included tbh). In the end he has spent three good seasons with Sampdoria.
Now it is possible that Genoa win in the next weekend and that would be lethal to Giampaolo, because of that 99% of supporters, but if it happened I'd remain confident he could have turned things for the better if he had been given the chance.

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post #15 of 38 (permalink) Old October 2nd, 2019, 23:24
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Well Gasperini started horribly at Atalanta didn't he? Then he became a legend there.

Thing is though, a club like Atalanta can give time to a coach to work but at Milan it's a different matter.

It was enough to watch the Udinese match to be sure that Milan won't finish top 4 this season.

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Juventus were relegated to Serie B along with their reputation.
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post #16 of 38 (permalink) Old October 3rd, 2019, 04:08
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Milan is pretty much as good or as bad as it was one season ago so if Giampaolo after 38 games gains 68 points he has done what one would expect from him with this team. If you sack him now you will never know, maybe you prefer it that way!
And yeah, watching games doesn't automatically give a clue. It is odd that people who think coaches are clueless pretend that any supporter who watches the games has a clue!
So you don't watch the games but you say you know how many points teams are going to make and how good they are. No one can predict the future, but those who don't watch definitely can't.

I don't have anything against your boy Giampaolo, just call it as I see it -- so far this is the worst Milan I've ever seen. By a distance. I've watched almost every game, every season for the past 30 years.

Milan so far are much, much worse than last season in all aspects of the game, with a similar or better squad. This is not just fans' impressions. Look at the stats from the games. Look at the formations in some of the games. Look at the things the managers says when he talks to the press. Look at the results and against who they were. It's all objectively shit.

You can repeat the amount of points and the Roma teams spiel, but the reality is that what matters is how you do relative to other teams.

You mention Juve and Allegri, but this is a poor Milan, not a brilliant up-and-coming Juve, and Giampaolo has the CV of a mediocre manager, whereas Allegri had already won the league and generally performed above expectations for Milan. Giampaolo's career is divided between good spells at Ascoli and Empoli (i.e. midtable finishes), a bunch of failures at teams like Cesena, and more mid table finishes at Sampdoria. People may say very nice things about him, but I see no reason to believe that he can take this Milan to anything higher than midtable, and a lot to believe that the longer he stays, the more likely a catastrophic outcome.

If Milan keep playing like a Serie B team, as anyone who actually watches the games will agree, things won't look great.
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post #17 of 38 (permalink) Old October 3rd, 2019, 05:31
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post #18 of 38 (permalink) Old October 3rd, 2019, 09:36
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post #19 of 38 (permalink) Old October 3rd, 2019, 09:36
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So you don't watch the games but you say you know how many points teams are going to make and how good they are. No one can predict the future, but those who don't watch definitely can't.
Sorry, I could not watch all serie A games even if I wanted. And yeah, it might happen that people who don't watch ALL the games might have a clue while people who pretend they watch every game have none, the way there are people who need one minute to learn a thing and people who would not learn it in one century.

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I don't have anything against your boy Giampaolo, just call it as I see it -- so far this is the worst Milan I've ever seen. By a distance. I've watched almost every game, every season for the past 30 years.
It is not "my boy", dear community manager, he is just a former coach of Sampdoria. I won't enter the "it has been the worst Milan..." thing, a supporter thing, a hyperbole. Bad? Ok. So far it is just 6 games anyway. I understand it could be more than enough in football, but I also know it ISN'T really enough to judge the work of "my boy" or anyone else, dear community manager. After 6 games you might have the feeling it is not going to work forever and prefer to change the coach, fair enough.

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Milan so far are much, much worse than last season in all aspects of the game, with a similar or better squad. This is not just fans' impressions. Look at the stats from the games. Look at the formations in some of the games. Look at the things the managers says when he talks to the press. Look at the results and against who they were. It's all objectively shit.
I don't understand the reason why you go on repeating this when I have never written anything which might suggest the opposite. Actually I have written Giampaolo had similar problems at Sampdoria in the first 6 games of his first season. You want him sacked? Let's hope together that he will be sacked! Hopefully he will also come back to Sampdoria at the beginning of the next season.

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You can repeat the amount of points and the Roma teams spiel, but the reality is that what matters is how you do relative to other teams.
It matters the amount of points you gain at the end of the season because 68 points is not enough for the CL spot most of times. I'm not sure I get your argument anyway. Is Milan really any better if Roma and Lazio choke? I was talking about points and using Roma and Lazio just to tell you that almost reaching a target thanks to the other clubs choking doesn't mean that in the following seasons the situation might be similar.... unless "my boy" affects the performances of Lazio and Roma too.

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You mention Juve and Allegri, but this is a poor Milan, not a brilliant up-and-coming Juve, and Giampaolo has the CV of a mediocre manager, whereas Allegri had already won the league and generally performed above expectations for Milan.
I'm pretty sure I have explained before that I don't think Giampaolo(or anyone else) had a real chance to enter the top 4 of serie A. The one with Juventus was just a huge example of a club having a very poor start of the season in terms of points and turning things for the better (much better indeed!). I was not going to compare Milan to Juventus for sure! There are many examples, Ahmed mentioned another, a better one indeed, because I remember the supporters of Atalanta saying that Gasperini was an idiot.

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Giampaolo's career is divided between good spells at Ascoli and Empoli (i.e. midtable finishes), a bunch of failures at teams like Cesena, and more mid table finishes at Sampdoria. People may say very nice things about him, but I see no reason to believe that he can take this Milan to anything higher than midtable, and a lot to believe that the longer he stays, the more likely a catastrophic outcome.
Your opinion. It is as good or as bad as any other opinion.

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If Milan keep playing like a Serie B team, as anyone who actually watches the games will agree, things won't look great.
I'm not sure I find that line in which I wrote Milan played great football up to now, maybe you can help me with your super community manager powers... I believe I just wrote that I think Giampaolo can turn things for the better, if he is given the chance (which I doubt). At Sampdoria he was one goal of Bruno Fernandes in the loss time away from being sacked, before things turned good, so you understand episodes are crucial.... but I'm talking to a guy who watched almost all the games in the last 30 season so I don't need to tell him that episodes are crucial in changing the fate of players, teams... and coaches!

Last edited by ToniSamp; October 3rd, 2019 at 09:49.
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post #20 of 38 (permalink) Old October 3rd, 2019, 12:22 Thread Starter
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In 2015/2016 Juventus had 5 points after 6 games and they won the scudetto nevertheless. Allegri had already been sacked by 99% of supporters of course, but it's a thing which had already happened before and it happened later, whenever he didn't win.
One year later, in his first season at Sampdoria, Giampaolo had 6 points after 6 games and was very close to be sacked, or at least 99% of supporters wanted him sacked (me included tbh). In the end he has spent three good seasons with Sampdoria.
Now it is possible that Genoa win in the next weekend and that would be lethal to Giampaolo, because of that 99% of supporters, but if it happened I'd remain confident he could have turned things for the better if he had been given the chance.
Yeah but it would be easy to find much more examples of teams having 5-6 pts after 6 rounds and ending up having shit seasons. I mean this is what usually happens.

Big games are easy than the other games, unfortunately. Every times we have the control the games, under the control the games, during the games we had the some possibilities, some big chances, some big okazyons, something like that but what can I do, sometimes? And….it’s the football, that’s the football, something happened. Everything is something happened. - Fatih Terim
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