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post #1 of 14 (permalink) Old February 19th, 2006, 22:22 Thread Starter
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A question about Dimitar Penev!

A question about Dimitar Penev! You know Dimitar Penev, manager who led you to the WC in a group with Sweden and France, then took you to 4th in the World, with wins over Argentina, Germany and Mexico on the way and an unlucky loss to Italy. Then in qualifying for Euro 96, you beat Germany 3-2 in a stirring match and it could have been a lot more than 3 by all accounts. Then you missed out in the Group of Death by 1 point, with a win over Romania and a draw with Spain. You played attacking football. When you take all of that into account, what I don't understand is why you sacked him?!?!?! He was your best manager of all time, and you were in the Group of Death. I mean, Iordanescu was not as good for Romania, but he wasn't sacked, because the FA realised how hard a group it was and past achievements and how it would be mad to sack him, so the fact that penev was sacked was crazy!
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post #2 of 14 (permalink) Old February 20th, 2006, 01:02
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we tend not to appreciate what we have until we lose it. I know it's a well know maxima, but it is valid to a greater extent for Bulgaria. After Beating Germany people expected us to at least repeat the success from 1994. There was some serious critique about the way he managed the team during the games and especially for using his nephew Lubo Penev, which was ridiculous because he had just won the Primera Division with Atletico, being the topscorer for the team...

Quite frankly I still do not know why the president of the football union Ivan Slavkov decided to sack Penev... :thmbdown:
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post #3 of 14 (permalink) Old February 20th, 2006, 01:08 Thread Starter
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Weren't Bonev and Markov also fired, ironically the last 2 guys since Penev to get you to major tournaments?
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post #4 of 14 (permalink) Old February 20th, 2006, 04:21
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yes, but the decision for both was... kind of reasonable, after losing 6:1 to Spain in 1998 and 5:0 to Sweden in 2004...

and I suspect your next question is how come Stoichkov was not fired after failing to qualify us for Germany 2006? The answer to that is suprisingly simple - he is Stoichkov! ANY other guy would have been fired after a 1:1 draw in Hungary, and 2 home losses vs Croatia and Sweden...
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post #5 of 14 (permalink) Old February 21st, 2006, 05:51
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well its not like everything was up to penev...
i hate the fact that every time a team does great the coach is made a hero. I mean since we cant really see what the coach does we evaluate him on the performance on the team, but Stoichkov was the real hero in 94 and if stoichkov wasnt there, Penev wouldnt have done anything.. We had a terrific team and Penev just gathered the team, but its not always up to the coaches.
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post #6 of 14 (permalink) Old February 22nd, 2006, 01:02
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well, ac milan, I, too, think that Stoichkov was the real hero, but one the other hand it can be said or yet, if you tend to it, twisted in antoher version - Stoichkov being the best player and one not only with a local quality didnt guarantee us such a good performance, so Penev was the real reason behind the succes, cuz he could motivate the team and making a group, who gets a perfect understanding when on field, out of a bunch of "show-off-machos" (many of them being from the first generation playing out of our borders and doing well) - so having good players who act like beach-boys is a hard job on itself, too.

Playing cards, relaxing at a swimmpool having a drink and smoking cigars?
Followed by a game against the world champions?

Classic.


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post #7 of 14 (permalink) Old February 22nd, 2006, 01:08
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pe3ucTop
yes, but the decision for both was... kind of reasonable, after losing 6:1 to Spain in 1998 and 5:0 to Sweden in 2004...
Werent they saying about Markov, that he hadnt knelt before the BFS and didnt place 'certain' "talents" into the team, creating uneasy time for the footbal managers?

and only to think that he took the fiance of his daughter later in the team...






uh, true?

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post #8 of 14 (permalink) Old February 23rd, 2006, 00:13 Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by xtc
well, ac milan, I, too, think that Stoichkov was the real hero, but one the other hand it can be said or yet, if you tend to it, twisted in antoher version - Stoichkov being the best player and one not only with a local quality didnt guarantee us such a good performance, so Penev was the real reason behind the succes, cuz he could motivate the team and making a group, who gets a perfect understanding when on field, out of a bunch of "show-off-machos" (many of them being from the first generation playing out of our borders and doing well) - so having good players who act like beach-boys is a hard job on itself, too.

Playing cards, relaxing at a swimmpool having a drink and smoking cigars?
Followed by a game against the world champions?

Classic.

Yes. Because Bonev hads that same team, and apart from the win v Russia (a top 5 team) in qualifying, he did not achieve results anywhere near as good as under Penev, so it is mostly down to the manager. I mean, you would have blamed Penev had it all gone wrong in 1994 and said 'he is a poor manager', so give him the credit he is due wghen you get to the semis. I mean, had Graham Taylor, or Bponev, or Romanstev or even Houllier been in charge, you wouldn't have qualified so give Penev great credit for his achievements.
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post #9 of 14 (permalink) Old February 23rd, 2006, 23:21
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After the leaving of Penev, the players were totally our of control and they acted with a high hand after the achievment from the 94's WC and eventually got silky with eachother what resulted in awful atmosphere on and off the pitch. i dont know if penev could handle that but Bonev couldnt fo sho.

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post #10 of 14 (permalink) Old February 23rd, 2006, 23:37
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Originally Posted by Gunes=genius
Yes. Because Bonev hads that same team, and apart from the win v Russia (a top 5 team) in qualifying, he did not achieve results anywhere near as good as under Penev, so it is mostly down to the manager. I mean, you would have blamed Penev had it all gone wrong in 1994 and said 'he is a poor manager', so give him the credit he is due wghen you get to the semis. I mean, had Graham Taylor, or Bponev, or Romanstev or even Houllier been in charge, you wouldn't have qualified so give Penev great credit for his achievements.
it was the balkan syndrome, not the coach... we though we would get out of group without too much problem and tho we were kings of the world.
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post #11 of 14 (permalink) Old February 24th, 2006, 22:37 Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by ac_milan_foreva
it was the balkan syndrome, not the coach... we though we would get out of group without too much problem and tho we were kings of the world.
I'm not referring to 1998, I am referring to the very tricky qualifying campaign for 1994, in a group with France and Sweden, and to get through that shows how good Penev was.
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post #12 of 14 (permalink) Old February 25th, 2006, 01:13
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Originally Posted by Gunes=genius
Houllier been in charge, you wouldn't have qualified so give Penev great credit for his achievements.
...
I am referring to the very tricky qualifying campaign for 1994, in a group with France and Sweden, and to get through that shows how good Penev was.
actually i would credit houllier, and not penev for our success back then... i'm pretty sure my compatriots will concur on this one

in all seriousness the campaign was a total failiure with 2 games to go: a loss to a uber-weak austria, a humiliating loss and a draw against sweden, a home draw with debutant israel, with the high points being a good win against france in sofia, two good wins against finland and an away win against israel. we were out :irritate:

and then the team had their first truly great game of the campaign, albeit a meaningless one - a 4:1 win over fellow loosers austria, which could have easily been a 40:1... and then the mid-nigh news bulletin started with the sensational news that france has lost at home to israel :sweeteye:

the rest as they say is history... a history that involved an awful atmosphere in the team, as demonstrated by a threatened boycott by half of the starting XI for the last game a great history with a holywood ending
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post #13 of 14 (permalink) Old February 25th, 2006, 03:33
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Originally Posted by LevskiSofiaFC
the rest as they say is history... a history that involved an awful atmosphere in the team, as demonstrated by a threatened boycott by half of the starting XI for the last game a great history with a holywood ending
history, hehe...

which game are you actually talking about when mentioning a boycott?
I remember there was sth like this, I just dont happen to remember the exact game.
And are you skipping the part where we got that 4th place?

I agree that the atmosphere got later on pretty awful, however I tend more to praise em all than blame em for the latter - intrigues will be forever, 4th place on the other hand may not come that soon again.

With this in mind - stay positive.

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post #14 of 14 (permalink) Old February 25th, 2006, 14:34
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the boycott was before the france-bulgaria game in 1993... and yes, dimitar penev was sacked b/c he let his nephew lubo penev play at the euro96 and score two own goals in the deciding group match vs france (hmm some sweet revenge for the frenchies)... and many people were questioning d.penev's management of the team - i too thought that stoichkov was in fact in charge of selection, tactics and even medical treatment

penev proved himself not to be a simple dummy during a great spell he had at cska after that, when imho his 1998 uefa campaign reignited bulgarian club football in europe, the zenith of which is levski's performance this season

he was dully sacked in 2000 by the newly elected president of cska, a fellow by the name of lubo penev, the very same person, who cost him his job as a national manager in 1996... irony you say - now you know irony
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