Would you trade Davis/Irving for #1 pick in 2014 draft? - Xtratime Community
 
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post #1 of 20 (permalink) Old December 13th, 2013, 12:50 Thread Starter
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Would you trade Davis/Irving for #1 pick in 2014 draft?

I wouldn't trade Anthony Davis as he is already a great player and still has room for further improvement. I think it's a safe bet to say he'll have a greater NBA career than any of the 2014 draft's heralded stars and would also be picked first in this year's draft...Wiggins and Parker have received national hype since their junior HS season and therefore it seems to me they are overvalued as prospects in comparison to the Unibrow. Davis was a late bloomer and despite of his insane stats in his freshman college season the hype never quite caught up with his rapid development.

But when it comes to Irving he'd be an easy decision to trade for a top 3 pick in the upcoming draft...he came to the league as an incredibly polished and mature player but hasn't showed any improvement compared to his rookie season. Quite likely he has already reached his prime and I don't think it's good enough...he's not a good facilitator for a PG and is also a poor defender which hurts him especially in head-to-head battles with other star PG's.

Big games are easy than the other games, unfortunately. Every times we have the control the games, under the control the games, during the games we had the some possibilities, some big chances, some big okazyons, something like that but what can I do, sometimes? AndÖ.itís the football, thatís the football, something happened. Everything is something happened. - Fatih Terim
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post #2 of 20 (permalink) Old December 13th, 2013, 13:42
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Surely not Davis.

Not sure about Kyrie either, but it'll definitely be something to ponder on.

Embiid looks like someone who if he pens out, has the highest ceiling out of the 2014 group to me... extremely intriguing.

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post #3 of 20 (permalink) Old December 13th, 2013, 14:52
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Tough call. Probably not. There would have to be another incentive, like a 2nd draft pick or another really good young player.

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post #4 of 20 (permalink) Old December 13th, 2013, 15:05
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Crazy enough, the Cavs actually might get into the lottery again this year.

Imagine...

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post #5 of 20 (permalink) Old December 15th, 2013, 10:51
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Great thread Andrew.

Hmm it would be a tough call definitely.

Anthony Davis is a proven player his only issue is his unusual physical development.

Kyrie Irving on the other hand as you've pointed out hasn't improved since his Rookie Year even after getting better players around him.

Assuming these small forwards are the "Next LeBron James", in that case I would trade without having 2nd thoughts. But if they're just typical all-star level small forwards MAYBE for Anthony Davis (assuming he's injury prone).

The problem of trading Kyrie for one of these top prospects is that you'll have to find another top-tier point guard in his place which could be a pain in the ass and could be a time consuming process.
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post #6 of 20 (permalink) Old December 15th, 2013, 12:59
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irving for sure, davis no
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post #7 of 20 (permalink) Old December 16th, 2013, 06:15
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Davis, if he can stay healthy, will go down as a future Hall of Famer for me. Kyrie... not so much. I would definitely take a top five pick for Kyrie at this point.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Pila View Post
That was a shot. However, when he hits those trivelas one of two things happen-

1-Joshua has an orgasm.

2-Queresma scoress, and Joshua has an orgasm.

This time he got a lucky assist, but you can still bet Joshua had an orgasm.
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post #8 of 20 (permalink) Old December 16th, 2013, 10:01 Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by shiaben View Post
Assuming these small forwards are the "Next LeBron James", in that case I would trade without having 2nd thoughts. But if they're just typical all-star level small forwards MAYBE for Anthony Davis (assuming he's injury prone).
let's be honest...most of the greatly hyped college prospects do not become NBA legends and HoFs. It's always safer to assume they will be simply All Star level players.

But seeing what Davis has done this season it would be quite hard to trade him for anybody...he's easily the most valuable under 25 year old in the NBA at the moment. A great two-way player who is likely to further improve...injuries might become an issue but this risk is always there with almost all big men.

Big games are easy than the other games, unfortunately. Every times we have the control the games, under the control the games, during the games we had the some possibilities, some big chances, some big okazyons, something like that but what can I do, sometimes? AndÖ.itís the football, thatís the football, something happened. Everything is something happened. - Fatih Terim
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post #9 of 20 (permalink) Old December 16th, 2013, 17:44
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Speaking of Davis, I love that Pelicans team right now. Their young talent is immense, although I can't see Gordon and Evans co-existing. One of the two should get traded for a couple vet guys to add experience to their squad.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Pila View Post
That was a shot. However, when he hits those trivelas one of two things happen-

1-Joshua has an orgasm.

2-Queresma scoress, and Joshua has an orgasm.

This time he got a lucky assist, but you can still bet Joshua had an orgasm.
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post #10 of 20 (permalink) Old December 18th, 2013, 15:55
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How about Lillard, would you give him up? What a treat this guy is.

37 points, 10 assists last night including the game-winner.


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post #11 of 20 (permalink) Old December 18th, 2013, 16:25
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Jrue Holiday, a decent solid PG but by no means a star, recently got traded for a top 5 pick plus another first rounder that is top 3 protected. It's safe to say that no potential franchise player is getting traded for just one pick.

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post #12 of 20 (permalink) Old December 28th, 2013, 14:56
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If I had the opportunity, I'm not sure I'd even trade Valanciunas for Embiid.

We're already investing in a young prospect at that position, why start from scratch again?

16 points, 18 rebounds last night against Tyson Chandler

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post #13 of 20 (permalink) Old December 28th, 2013, 15:45
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Anthony Davis is having a killer season. 19-10 with 3 blocks a game. 27.1 PER, .233 WS/48. Pelicans are 10-10 when he plays. And only his second season. I hope they can land a good center and allow him to move over and have more freedom at PF. We might see 25-13 out of him that way.

By comparison, Kyrie: 22-3-6, 19.5 PER, .093 WS/48. And the Cavs are 10-18 when he plays.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Pila View Post
That was a shot. However, when he hits those trivelas one of two things happen-

1-Joshua has an orgasm.

2-Queresma scoress, and Joshua has an orgasm.

This time he got a lucky assist, but you can still bet Joshua had an orgasm.
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post #14 of 20 (permalink) Old December 28th, 2013, 20:09
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I'd take Lillard over Davis/Kyrie.

Davis hasn't shown me a good post game where you can go to him every time down the floor and expect a good bucket every other possession. He mostly gets garbage points. His strength is also a question.

Kyrie has shown little progress rom his rookie year.


How about this for a question -- Lillard + Cousins OR Irving + Davis? I'd go with the former.

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post #15 of 20 (permalink) Old December 28th, 2013, 20:56 Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SacHercegovac View Post
I'd take Lillard over Davis/Kyrie.

Davis hasn't shown me a good post game where you can go to him every time down the floor and expect a good bucket every other possession. He mostly gets garbage points. His strength is also a question.

Kyrie has shown little progress rom his rookie year.


How about this for a question -- Lillard + Cousins OR Irving + Davis? I'd go with the former.
you got to be kidding me...I guarantee you that 30 out of 30 NBA GM's would disagree with you. He's already one of the best big men in the league in his 2nd season.

Big games are easy than the other games, unfortunately. Every times we have the control the games, under the control the games, during the games we had the some possibilities, some big chances, some big okazyons, something like that but what can I do, sometimes? AndÖ.itís the football, thatís the football, something happened. Everything is something happened. - Fatih Terim
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post #16 of 20 (permalink) Old December 28th, 2013, 21:13
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Like I said, he scores garbage points. His post game is fairly non-existent. He needs to build up much more muscle as well. Lillard is also one of the best point guards already in his second season. Lillard has the clutch gene.

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post #17 of 20 (permalink) Old December 28th, 2013, 22:11 Thread Starter
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bullshit, points are points.

your subjective opinion vs official statline of 27 PER, which one seems more legit?

Big games are easy than the other games, unfortunately. Every times we have the control the games, under the control the games, during the games we had the some possibilities, some big chances, some big okazyons, something like that but what can I do, sometimes? AndÖ.itís the football, thatís the football, something happened. Everything is something happened. - Fatih Terim
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post #18 of 20 (permalink) Old December 29th, 2013, 00:00
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The difference between Lilard and Irving is minimal to be honest. Both are scoring PG's that aren't elite playmakers and cannot defend very well.

Davis is not yet a ideally a number one option on offence and being paired with Irving he wouldn't have to be, but he can still get you 20+ points with fantastic efficiency and provides elite defence. You cannot say that same for Cousins defensively. Cousins is generally fine on post ups, but anything else on the defensive end he tends to struggle. The Kings' record would be better if Cousins didn't give away needless fouls on the defensive end and get himself in foul trouble.

I'm liking what I am seeing offensively from Cousins this season though. He's taking shots closer to the basket and playing smarter basketball this season. I would have him down easily as an All-Star if he was playing in the Eastern conference.
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post #19 of 20 (permalink) Old December 29th, 2013, 03:52
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SacHercegovac View Post
I'd take Lillard over Davis/Kyrie.

Davis hasn't shown me a good post game where you can go to him every time down the floor and expect a good bucket every other possession. He mostly gets garbage points. His strength is also a question.

Kyrie has shown little progress rom his rookie year.


How about this for a question -- Lillard + Cousins OR Irving + Davis? I'd go with the former.
It's a bit unfair to compare Lillard to Davis, considering how much more Lillard has played than Davis. Lillard has almost 2000 more MP than Davis. He also has a lot more freedom than Davis. The big man has been doing well defensively, due in part to having to play more defense since there isn't another dominating big man on his team. If Asik ended up on the Pelicans, it would be ideal for Davis because he could focus more on his offense instead of having to protect the rim in addition to being the big offensive outlet.

Cousins is having a pretty good year (23-11, 26.5 PER, .163 WS/48), but like Andy pointed out, he can end up being a detriment to the team (which is reflected in his relatively low WS/48 stat when compared to his PER. Usually when a player has a 25+ PER he averages at least .200 WS/48). Davis, on the other hand, doesn't make the kinds of mistakes Cousins does.

Of course, I do love Boogie and I believe this Kings team is on the way up. But, as usual, Boogie needs a big attitude change. He has done well, but when it comes to dealing with teammates he still has some trouble. I can see him ending up as an evolutionary, better Shawn Kemp, but could also see him leading the path of a ZBo before his attitude change: a decent player without any titles/playoff runs.

If I had to build a team, I'd take Lillard and Davis.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Andy Christ View Post
you got to be kidding me...I guarantee you that 30 out of 30 NBA GM's would disagree with you. He's already one of the best big men in the league in his 2nd season.
Agreed. Leads the league in BPG, is second in PER among big men (behind only Kevin Love), and leads the league in block percentage. He's on his way to the top. If I were the Pelicans GM I'd try to find a way to trade Tyreke for a defensive big man + a role player.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Pila View Post
That was a shot. However, when he hits those trivelas one of two things happen-

1-Joshua has an orgasm.

2-Queresma scoress, and Joshua has an orgasm.

This time he got a lucky assist, but you can still bet Joshua had an orgasm.

Last edited by Kocaman Adam; December 29th, 2013 at 03:59.
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post #20 of 20 (permalink) Old December 29th, 2013, 16:00
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I remember before the NBA drafts the player comparisons (primary one) for Lillard was "The Next Rose" and for Irving "The Next Paul".

Back then we'd figure these guys would be starting point guards for sure but whether or not they could lead their teams to championship success is another question.

Right now there's some degree of confidence in Lillard, especially with this superior cast he has at the moment. He could mature very quick and become a top 3 point guard if he's serious about his intentions (Rose is gone, Williams is shit, others developing or injuerd)

Kyrie on the other hand as had a mediocre year and his cast is somewhat crap to other star point guards. I'd like to see what would happen if he had more or less a legitimate cast. Would there still be excuses.

As for Davis and Cousins. I'd go with Davis as he's an all-around player.Cousins needs work on his defense.
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