SiCG and other questions.

I apologise if I have asked these questions before, but I would like some answers and dates.

1. When is our flag and anthem changing? I heard July 2, still nothing.

2. Has FSSCG had any discussions on what our strip will look like and who will provide it? I heard a rumour that we are going back to adidas.

1. Well our flag was supposed to change all with the anthem soon but now the retared montenegrin politicians are sabotaging it all over again. I swear the only thing they do in the federal parliament is sabotage...urgh.

2. No clue.

2. Has FSSCG had any discussions on what our strip will look like and who will provide it? I heard a rumour that we are going back to adidas.

I really do hope we go back to Adidas, I loved those jerseys...

1) I hope our anthem and flag actually don't change..Did you see some of their propositions? Our flag would have two crests, a Serbian and Montenegrin (?) one.. Our anthem would also be actually split into two, one part would be "Boze Pravde" while the other to satisfy Montenegrins (?) would include "Oj svijetla majska zoro". To make matters worse, both anthems would be played at the same time.. :thmbdown: It's embarrasing..

2) I haven't heard anything about it, I don't mind Lotto.. With adidas we look just like any other team, at least we're original in our Lotto kits..

Yes I like the lotto shirts too now. The idea with 2 coats-of-arms was rejected. They were supposed to have a settled on a shade of blue but now I hear Marovic talking about two blue stripes (?). As for the anthems, the two tunes would be played one after the other (like the old Czechoslovak anthem which had 2 parts and also the old yugo royal anthem which had 3). If they are blended in well, I wouldn't mind...if you ask me I'd let them have a referendum tomorrow so they can leave or just shut up.

"Oj svijetla majska zoro" simply doesn't sound like an anthem to me. I'm not an expert but it simply doesn't.

The lotto kits are nice, i dunt think we will be changing them soon, we just got them.

:D

It's a freakin' patriotic folk song. But Montenegro's real anthem, "Onamo namo" (not a bad tune IMO) is "too serbian" for the current neo-dukljani ensemble in power. :rollani:
I bet they'll scratch the "serbian" lines from "oj svijetla majska zoro" too. Idiots. Why is our country being pulled by the finger by a bunch of idiots? Ugh. :wallbang:

Serbia should let montenegro go, there just holding us back from going towards the future. We cant have a proper flag or a proper anthem with them, Serbia should just tell them to go if they wanna go, theyll be begging us in about 2 years time to come back anyway. They have nothing to live off in Montenegro anyway ... what are they going to eat ? fish .. drink sea water ? .. Montenegro is nothing without Serbia. :doh:

Serbia should let montenegro go, there just holding us back from going towards the future.

:rollani:

What about those that feel Serbian or want to remain with Serbia? Which BTW are larger in number than those brainwashed by Milo and his alike. If it ever comes to the day Montenegro separates, then it will be a terrible shame for all Serbs.

There won't be changes in the SCG anthem and flag till the referendum which is a part of the Belgrade treaty ("Beogradski sporazum"). Moreover, neither Srbia nor Montenegro have official anthems yet, nor Serbia has new coat of arms (still has the ones of Soc. Rep. Serbia), nor Monenegro has her official flag (the one with sky-blue color is just temporary and was created only to differ from the Serbian flag). Recently, Montenegrin Parliament had a debate on the flag an anthem. The proposed flag - red flag with the white Montenegrin eagle (it looks like the Albanian flag with white eagle instead of black) - and the proposed anthem - "Oj svijetla..." were discussed but not addopted. Consequently, no changes in the SCG flag will occur. On the other hand, there is no debate in the Serbian Parliament about the state symbol and state anthem. Till Serbia has her new constitution, we will have what we have. So no need to blame Montenegro for all stupidities since the state of Serbia has her substantial share when it comes to stupidities.

Even the coat of arms that Savo displays in his avtar is irregular and is made to look like Serbian, but it really is not the Serbian Royal Eagle. So they should either bring back the real Srerbian white eagle, or remove this double-headed bird and put some republican symbol that symbolizes nation and the country (Pancicevu omoriku, gusle, sljivu, frulu, ili kombinaciju).

Finally, for Savo and all other Montenegring bashers. Mind your own business and leave Serbia and Montenegro coexist together. There are 50+% of people in Montenegro who declare themselves as Serbian, and they have done that often risking their jobs, safty and well being. So, who are you to suggest that those people should be cut off from Serbia? Moreover, if Montenegro ever leaves the common state, a great part of Serbian cultural and historical tradition will go away. And Serbian cultural heritage and tradition is not big enough to forfiet a part of it just because there is a group of Montenegrin mafia politicians who want to gain independence for tehir own profit. Future generations of Serbs without the tradition of Miljanov's "Cojstvo i junastvo", without Njegos' "Gorski vijenac", etc. will be different than the ones who were brought up on those traditions. And those were not only Montenegrin Serbs but Serbs everywhere where Serbian name is mentioned and honored.

Montenegro bashers ? ha ha ha

good one man.

I dunt bash montenegro, i state the facts, the fact is the a big number of Montengrins in Montenegro dont call themselves "Serbs", they refer to themselves as "Montenegrins". Which infact is a Serb ? or not a Serb ?

Why dont you tell me ben ?

:D

:rollani:

What about those that feel Serbian or want to remain with Serbia? Which BTW are larger in number than those brainwashed by Milo and his alike. If it ever comes to the day Montenegro separates, then it will be a terrible shame for all Serbs.

Thats what im saying, Milo is the person who is to blame for this, he has brainwashed the Montenegro people, one day he will be pro Serbia and Montenegro, and then the next day, he tells his people Montenegro deserves to be one country.

He is one day something else, and then the next day he totaly breaks his promises and lies.

We shouldn't "let them go"...but we should force them to a referendum. It's clear: in the official census 36% declared themselves Serbian 40% Montenegrin and 62% declared Serbian as the mother tongue. We can't lose. Then, once they lose this referendum, then the DPS-kamarila is gone. Argh.

Yeah, and I bet out of that 40%, at least 50% are siptari..

Montenegro bashers ? ha ha ha

good one man.

I dunt bash montenegro, i state the facts, the fact is the a big number of Montengrins in Montenegro dont call themselves "Serbs", they refer to themselves as "Montenegrins". Which infact is a Serb ? or not a Serb ?

Why dont you tell me ben ?

:D

Whatever you say, without going into too much detail, all I will say is my relatives claim to be Serbs living in Montenegro and as a result their municipality (Berane) has been the poorest (for a long time) of any in all of SCG. Why? Because Milo only gives money to those which say to be anything but Serbs, while those that claim otherwise are left with next to nothing...So you go on telling those people they are useless, not needed, a thorn in Serbia's back etc. and see for yourself the reactions you'll get.

....and see for yourself the reactions you'll get.
Oh, that one is easy to guess: pašče.

Srbija ne treba da prisiljava Crnu Goru na referendum. Iskustvo nas je valjda naucilo da nikoga ninasta ne treba da prisiljavamo, ma kako namere bile plemenite. Referendum je predvidjen Beogradskim sporazumom i kada se 3 godine od pocetka tog sporazuma navrsi, u Crnoj Gori ce biti raspisan referendum o samostalnosti. Do tada, Srbija treba da uradi da pokaze da zajednicka drzava pravi mnogo vise smisla ne go dve odvojene drzave i ekonomski, i sa stanovisat odbrane, i sa stanovista okruzenja, i kulturno, i istorijski. A za to je potrebno da se u Srbiji jednom i zauvek okoncaju seseljijade, arkanijade, dogadjanja naroda, nebesnjacke histerije, anti-zapadnjastvo, anti-modernizam i pravoslavni fundamentalizam koji su svi skupa ucinili da se ljudi klone Srbije i Srba, i da ako vec ne mogu da popbegnu iz zemlje, pobegnu od srpskog porekla i zagrljaja. Srbija je na dobrom putu da se to vise ne ponovi, a oni koji su se pokolebali pocece ponovo da blagonaklono gledaju na Srbiju i Srbe, pogotovo ako Srbija pocne ekonomski da prosperira, modernizuje se, okrene Zapadu i da bude tolerantna etnicki i politicki. U toj konkurenciji Milova politicka opcija gubi.

I just hope this problem can be resolved soon and peacefully of course.
We are all the same people, just living in a different land, so, what's the big deal.
Montenegrins are simply Serbs who escaped from the Turkish rule in Serbia and fled to the 'black mountains'. That is Montenegro, for people to be forgetting about their background because some idiot nowdays is telling them otherwise is very sad.
I think if Montenegro were to go, than it would be horrible, think about the future, soon Vojvodina would go too as they would claim to be 'Vojvodinians' :rolleyes:
This bullshit needs to stop, and it needs to stop now.

Reading some of those posts has been very interesting and I really respect Ben's and some other posters opinions here, but to make a point Vojvodina was never Serbia's before 1918(it was Croatian-Hungarian) but due to huge population changes(Serbs escaping Kosovo from Turkish onslaught and moving to Srijem-Backa-Banat) Serbs gained a majority and as soon as the union of Serbs-Croaians and Slovenians was established Serbs took control of "Vojvodina-named after Vojvoda Arsenije Crnojevic if I am correct? ) Just as Serbia took Boka Kotorska which had a 95% Croatian Catholic population back before the first juga and now has less than 5% Croatian population. Croatians and Crno Gorci have a lot of common history believe it or not but just as Vojvodina is now Serbia's and will stay that way Crna Gora will share the same fate because I believe today the majority(not all naturally) of Montenegrins are Serbians and will want to remain with Serbia, but there are a few who have remained what they were. Let the bashing begin :wallbang: ;) but I have stated what I think is true to the core.

Boka did not have a 95% Catholic, even less Croatian population. As for Vojvodina, Slavs actually settled there before Hungarians (in fact according to a growing shift among historians and archeologists the Danube basin is where Slavs began) and there were Serbs present in Srem since the middle ages. Arsenije Carnojevic was not a duke (vojvoda) but a patriarch of the Serbian church in the 17th century. Btw it's not "Crno Gorci" but "Crnogorci". The "common history" of Montenegro and Croatia you speak of is not great at all, as Montenegro always was a Serbian state and had very little to do with Croatia, bar some crazy Montenegrin Ustase (Sekula Drljevic) and their "Red Croatia" fairy tales.

Arsenije Carnojevic was a patrijarh (archibishop) not vojvoda. The name Vojvodina came after Serbian leaderes, vojvodas (e.g., vojvoda Stevan Supljikac). True that Vojvodina was part of Hungarian Kingdom when Serbs from Kosovo started moving in en mass (17th centry), but it was very little populated by mainly Hungarians. Main settlements were Austrian military posts (Zemun, Pancevo, Petrovaradin, Vrsac) around which Serbian population settled. Since most of the Serbs were merecenaries in the Austrian army, they were given a status of self-rule (vojvodstvo) and were directly subordinated to the Austrian court, not to Hungary. However, there were a number of cities that were primarily settled or founded by Serbian mercantile class (e.g., Novi Sad, Karlovci) which I think were under Hungarian jursidiction. Those were center of Serbian economic, cultural and spiritual life (Matica srpska, Karlovacki bogoslovija, gimnazija, theatre).

I think that Andrija knows this things much better than I do since he is from Vojvodina.

Serbs did not took Vojvodina nor Boka. Vojvodina joined Serbia by an overwhelming majority of votes. (Just imagine if Herceg-Bosna would wote on referendum to join Croatia what would be the outcome? Same was with Vojvodina and Montenegro). Boka was never taken by Serbia. It was included in the Kingdom of SHS after 1918. Serbia never had her borders established in that Kingdom. Later on, after federalization began, Boka belonged to Zetska banovina, which was not Serbia. There was no Serbian banovina in the Kingdom (There were Moravska, Dunavaska, parts of Drinska, Vardarska and Zetska banovina and the City of Belgrade which comprised today Serbia.) Serbia got her boundaries within Jugoslavia for the first time in 1945. Those boundaries included Vojvodina (as an autonomous province) and Kosmet (as autonomous district and later province). They did not include Macedonia which was within Serbia from 1913-1918. In 1939 Croatia got her own banovina (mostly Dravska, Primorska, parts of Savska, Zetska, Drinska, Dunavska banovine) which was the only ethnically/historically based banovina in the Kingdom. In 1945. Croatia lost some theritories which were in the Croatian banovina (mainly Herceg-Bosna), but gained Istria, Zadar, Krk, etc. from Italy.

I think that Andrija knows this things much better than I do since he is from Vojvodina.

Err, well, I'm from Belgrade actually.

Vojvodina as Ben correctly put it joined Serbia by referendum and another tidbit - "vojvodina" is just really short for "srpska vojvodina" or as it was called in Austria - Vojvodstvo Srbija i Tamiski Banat. Montenegro also joined democratically - there was an assembly elected exactly for that purpose with pro-unification (pro-Karadjordjevic, to be more exact) - white - and pro-indepedence (pro-Petrovic) - green - candidates. The whites won and the assembly voted for complete and conditionless unification with the Kingdom of Serbia (this did not include Boka of course, which was part of the Austrian province of Dalmatia). The creation of Montenegro as a separate federal unit in 1945 was done arbitrarily by the communists (federalist or green parties never had a majority of the vote in between the two wars) and the proclamation of a Montenegrin nationality had no basis in fact or history.
For all who wish to learn about the proud history of Montenegro from credible and authoritative sources, I suggest the excellent website http://www.njegos.org/
Since we are already at taking territories, there are interesting tales to tell when it comes to Croatia but I think I'd start a real mess if I started discussing it here, so I'll just leave it. For now. ;)

Sorry Andrija, I thought you're originally from Vojvodina. "Princes krofne - vangla cela" does not go along with a true Belgrader. ;)

That's just a leftover from our discussion about accents. If you like, I can put "jeeeeebote" in my sig. :) ;)

A, pa ne mozes ti da budes jedan od "Jeeebote Beogradjana". To je rezervisano za one iz Kruga dvojke. Ti si, ako se dobro secam, stanovao blizu Hajdukovog igralista, a to vec nije Beograd. Beograd se zavrsava kod Slavije a sve ostale livade i pobrdja iznad i okolo je wonnabe Beograd.;)

Didn't know where to put this, so, I put it here ;)
------------------------------------------------

Damjanovic takes FSSCG role
Tuesday, 6 July 2004
Zoran Damjanovic has been named as the new general secretary of the Football Association of Serbia and Montenegro (FSSCG).

New man
The 47-year-old will take the place of Branko Bulatovic who was assassinated in March this year in front of the FSSCG headquarters in Belgrade. Damjanovic is a lawyer by profession and was president of FK Rudar Pljevlja from 1992 to 1997. He was also member of the FSSCG executive committee from 1993 to 1997.

Footballing aims
Damjanovic will take charge of the association until September 2005 when all of the FSSCG officials' terms of office will end. "I am honoured to have been given this important role," said Damjanovic. "I will do my best to take over from the late Mr Bulatovic. The FSSCG has to become a modern company and create the best conditions for the the national teams to succeed."
----------------------------------------------------------------

Anyone know that much about this guy and what he can/can't do for us?

You could've placed in the thread I opened about it like 2 weeks ago :fero:

:D

Since we are talking politics, let me add something. I don't think that Serbia should join the West/EU, but rather be neutral. Serbia can be prosperous and wealthy without joining the EU. Joining the EU will not automatically make Serbia wealthy and modern. No one is going to build your country for you. Serbia needs to do it itself. For this reason I do not support this new government in Serbia. Tadic is just like the rest of the "democratic pro Western" leaders in Eastern Europe. Just a whole bunch of empty promises. Don't get me wrong. I hope I am wrong, and he does make a real difference in the country. I did not 100% support the Radikale either. Too many ties to the past and to Seselj.

Good to hear from you again, Jug Bogadane. Now as the one who voted for Tadic, let me ask you what promisses that he made you have in mind? I think that, unlike many politicians in Serbia of various persuasions and orientations, Tadic hasn't made gradious nor moderately gradious promisses. I think that he is a politician who is more concentrated towards establishing a political stability rather than making some radical turns or radical shakeups.

I wouldn't worry too much about Serbia joining EU; it won't happen for a while. Nevertheless, Serbia should not turn away from the West. Other alternatives are much worse. Neutrality is a commodity which one could have providing the conditions (political, geopolitical, economic, historical,cultural) are favorable. Serbia has none of those. She must rely on good will of her neighbors, good will and favors of her potential patrons as well as on her own resources and diligence in order to stand firm on her feet. For that, kako kazu seljaci u Sumadiji: Treba biti i vidra i ovca.

You could've placed in the thread I opened about it like 2 weeks ago :fero:

:D

Hehe, my bad :D

Moj cilj je da budemo tako bogati da biramo hoćemo li u Evropsku uniju ili ne – kao što to rade Švajcarska, Norveška ili Japan.

- Tomislav Nikolić



:howler:

Surely this flag and anthem situation will be sorted out before the Olympics. If not those Montenegrin Politicians must be the hardest people to negotiate with in the world. Makes me so angry.

All i hope for is we get rid of Hej sloveni ASAP ..... and put "Boze Prave" ASAP ! ;)

Savo did you get my PM??

Himna i zastava ne mogu da se promene politickim dekretom. Drugo, Srbija i Crna gora jos uvek nemaju svoja obelezja. Da bi drzavna zajednica dobila obelezja, svaka drzava-clanica mora da ima svoj grb, svoju zastavu i svoju himnu. Ti uslovi nisu jos uvek ispunjeni. Konacno, pesma "Boze Pravde" je monarhisticka himna i nije u duhu republike. Srbiji treba republikanska himna, ona koja simbolizuje zemlju, narod i drzavu a ne koja moli Boga za spas i dobrobit Krune i naroda. Moj izbor je "Oj Srbijo mila mati". Vedra je, rodoljubiva i nije posvecena ni monarhu, ni Bogu, ni vodji, ni partiji, vec iskljucivo Srbiji i onima koji u njoj zive. Uostalom, licemerno je da vise od 50% gradjana Srbije koji su ateisti peva "Boze Pravde".

Nemam nista protiv da se pominje Bog, ali kad malo razmislim moram priznati da ni ja ne vidim svrhu klicanja kralju, kraljici i ostalim. ;)

RSF, "Boze Pravde" je deo tradicije, lepa pesma, ali ona nema nista zajednicko sa republikom i jos manje sa generacijama koje su rodjeneod posle 1945. Nama, rodjenima posle 2. svetskog rata, ta pesma je bila poklic protiv komunistickog rezima i oduska nasim nacionalistickim porivima. Ona je nama sluzila kao pesma protesta, a ne kao himna drzavi.

CG ima i zastavu i grb koji su potpuno odgovarajuci himnu doduse nema. Srbija ima sva 3 obelezja ako te neko pita :) samo sto je grb komunjarski (gde ga ne promenise do sada) a himna ,,Mars na Drinu''.

Sto se tice ,,Boze pravde'': koliko god se meni vrtela u glavi pesma ,,oj srbijo mila mati'' (i to tvojom zaslugom, jer si me ti prvi na nju uputio:)) cinjenica je da vecina srpskog naroda smatra ,,Boze pravde'' za svoju himnu. Ta se himna pevala na na mitinzima protiv Milosevica, u dijaspori, i sve do 1941. ('45.) dok je nisu zabranili komunisti. Ako pitas prosecnog Srbina to je za njega himna zemlje, koliko god melodija "oj srbijo mila mati" ili tekst "vostani serbije" bio primamljiv s akademskog gledista (licno mi se svidja tekst "vostani serbije" najvise ali ne mogu nigde da nadjem muziku). Sto se tice monarhije, to su 2 reda teksta koja se lako promene (primer: himna Rep. Srpske).

Dakle licno ne mislim da Srbija ima sta da mozga oko simbola, u pitanju su samo nijanse. Zasto moramo svaki put jovo-nanovo da smisljamo himne, grbove, zastave? Postoji nesto sto je tu vec vise od 100 godina i sto je prepoznatljivo...

Uostalom, licemerno je da vise od 50% gradjana Srbije koji su ateisti peva "Boze Pravde".

http://www.statserb.sr.gov.yu/Zip/VJN3.pdf
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Vise od 50%?

Opa bato!!! Ti Srbi sve sami bogougodnici sto hodaju zemljom. Blago si ga Bogu. Ono sto me posebno impresionira je to naglo otreznjenje i okretanje Bogu nacije koja je do skoro bila 90% ateisticki i titoisticki nastrojena.

Mars na Drinu nije himna iz 2 razloga: 1. nikada nije ozvanicena kao himna i 2. To je mars a ne himna.

Crna Gora zastavu menja. Do jeseni Crna Gora ce imati crven barjak sa zlatnim ili belim orlom u letu. Crna Gora nema himnu. Postoji predlog himne "Oj svijetla..."; Peroviceva ideja a odnedavno su je prigrnuli Burzanovi i Milovi, i prema tome postace drzavna himna dekretom vladajucih partija. Bice komicno da Republika Crna Gora ima zastavu dianstije Petrovica. Glupost i skorojevicstvo danasnje crnogorske vlasti.

Konacno, "Boze pravde" je himna koju je po narudzbini komponovao hrvatski/slovenacki kompozitor Davorin Jenko da bi glorifikovao srpsku monarhiju. Posto su evropske monarhije tog vremena uglavnom imale himne u kojim se moli Bog da spasi kralja ili cara (npr. "God save the King" ili "Boze carja hrani") tako je trebalo da bude i sa novom srpskom himnom. Pogotovo sto je dotadasnja pesma koja je izvodjena kao himna, "Oj Srbijo mila mati", vise zvucala kao Marseljeza nego kao himna kralju pokornog, lojalnog, zahvalnog i bogougodnog naroda. Jebes himnu koju je pisao neko po narudzbini radi velicanja lika i dela kralja. S druge strane ako iz "Boze Pravde" izbacis stihove vezane za monarha i monarhiju i zamenis ih stihovima vezanim za drzavu, himna postaje besmislena. Bog i monarh idu zajedno jer ovaj drugi vlada po Milosti Bozijoj. Sta je to sto u republikanskoj drzavi ima veze sa vlascu po Milosti Bozijoj? Ja bih rekao nista i svaki pokusaj kalabudzenja takve vrste je glupost i skorojevicstvo. To nije nastavak tradicije jer ta tradicija - monarhija - je mrtva skoro 60 godina i nece vise nikada oziveti. Prema tome, zajedno sa monarhijom treba da odu i njena himna i njen grb. Srbiji treba dati republikanska obelezja; orlovi i ocila treba da ostanu zbog istoricnosti i drzavnosti ali bez krune i simbola vlasti na zemlji po Milosti Bozijoj.

Bog i monarh idu zajedno jer ovaj drugi vlada po Milosti Bozijoj. Sta je to sto u republikanskoj drzavi ima veze sa vlascu po Milosti Bozijoj?

Ehehe odakle takvo pitanje? Ne zivis li u good ol' U S of A?
Sta ono bese pise na svakoj novcanici? Kako bese pocinje ona zakletva? ;)

Kruna se nalazi na grbovima mnogih evropskih republika kao simbol suvereniteta ili zbog istorijske specificnosti (primer Madjarske).

Crna Gora zastavu menja. Do jeseni Crna Gora ce imati crven barjak sa zlatnim ili belim orlom u letu. Crna Gora nema himnu.

To je bila ideja SDP-separatista jer im je mnogo smetalo da svakog dana u skupstini gledaju srpsku trobojku (ljisica je bio taj Kralj Nikola, kazu). Medjutim ne verujem da tako nesto mogu da proguraju. Zastava se propisuje Ustavom a za promenu istog potrebna je 2/3 vecina. Najbolje je sto za himnu biraju tamo neku rodoljubivu pesmicu a ignorisu prave himne CG (,,ubavoj na Crnoj Gori'' i ,,Onamo, 'namo''). To nije skorojevicstvo, vec glupost i zelja odredjenih ljudi da budu nesto osim onoga sto stvarno jesu.

,,Mars na Drinu'' valjda i jeste ozvanicena (znam, glup izbor za himnu) jer se svaki put kada su raznorazni SPS/JUL funkcioneri polagali vence na spomenik ovome ili onome intonirala bas ta pesma (posle ,,Hej Sloveni''). To mi je onako ostalo u glavi gledajuci dnevnik RTS tu i tamo preko leta (malo radi komedije;)).

Uglavnom postoji vrlo jednostavan nacin da se resi ova polemika. Skupstina nek spremi predlog simbola, pa sve na referendum (djuture sa ustavom). Onda nek narod odluci, po Milosti Bozijoj. :)

Any updates ???

Unfortunately, yes.

Medjutim ne verujem da tako nesto mogu da proguraju. Zastava se propisuje Ustavom a za promenu istog potrebna je 2/3 vecina.

Well, I was wrong. Today Montenegro adopted a new flag, scrapping the Serb tricolor and going for a Montenegrin coat of arms on a red background as Ben Akiba said.

CG DOBILA NOVE SIMBOLE | 09:23 -> 21:22 | Izvor: SRNA

Podgorica -- Poslanici Skupštine Crne Gore usvojili su u ponedeljak uveče Zakon o državnim simbolima.

Prema ovom zakonu, nova zastava Crne Gore je crvene boje sa zlatnim orlom na sredini, dok je grb dinastije Petrovića sa krunom, skiptarom sa krstom u jednoj kandži i šarom sa krstom u drugoj. Himna Crne Gore je pesma "Oj svijetla majska zoro".

Dan državnosti Crne Gore po novom Zakonu je 13. jul, Dan ustanka naroda Crne Gore u Drugom svetskom ratu i dan kada je Crna Gora 1878. na Berlinskom kongresu stekla državnost.

Na sednici kojoj nisu prisustvovali poslanici opozicije, za Zakon o državnim simbolima glasalo je 38 poslanika vladajuće koalicije DPS-a, SDP-a i Građanske partije, dok je poslanik Demokratske unije Albanaca Ferhat Dinoša bio protiv.

Šef poslaničkog kluba DPS-a Miodrag Vuković istakao je da su državni simboli bitni za Crnu Goru, u trenutku kada hoće u Evropu. "Ovim simbolima se pokazuje da smo građanska država, na putu u Evropu", rekao je Vuković.

Poslanik SDP Ervin Spahić izjavio je da je razočaran što je Ðukanovićev DPS, kao većinski partner u vlasti insistirao na grbu Petrovića sa monarhističkim simbolima. On smatra da je trebalo usvojiti grb Crnojevića koji je bez monarhističkih simbola što je predlagala njegova partija. "Bošnjacima u Crnoj Gori nameće se da prihvate tuđe simbole kao što je grb sa monarhističkim znacima, krunom i krstovima. Podržaću Zakon da se ne bi ocijenilo da su Bošnjaci protiv Crne Gore i njenih državnih simbola", rekao je Spahić.

Potpredsednik Skupštine i poslanik SDP Rifat Rastoder istakao je da je podržao zakon "kršeći svoju savjest".

This is a problem. It means that the proposed joint tricolor (with the "famous" 300C blue) will no longer be acceptable to Montenegro because Montenegro no longer uses a tricolor. Not to mention that this move by the montenegrin authorities is retarded in many ways.

Oj kukavno srpstvo ugaseno...

Milu i njegovima nije ni do srpstva ni do crnogorstva. Njihov primarni interest je da zastite svoj mafijaski feud. Zato su i pristali na formiranje SiCG jer im nakaradno uredjenje koje ta zajednica drzava ima daje mogucnost da rade sta hoce bez ikakve odgovornosti i bez polaganja racuna bilo kome. Naravno, oni sve to zaogrcu u crnogorstvo i borbu protiv navodne srpske dominacije. Jedino tako mogu da odrzavaju politicku prevlast i striktnu kontrolu u svim drzavnim i nad svim privrednim resorima uz glasove desrbizovanih Crnogoraca i manjina kojima odvajanje Crne Gore od Srbije pruza priliku da oni to isto ucine u odnosu na Crnu Goru. On sto Milu u njegovima najvise smeta je bilo kakav politicki ili ekonomski uspeh Srbije u Evropi i svetu. Dolazak Tadica na vlast je dobro primljen na Zapadu. Milo i drustvo su ocekivali da ce da pobedi Toma Nikolic, da ce tim povodom Zapad vrlo lose da reaguje i da ce kao deo sankcionisanja Srbije za izbor Nikolica dozvoliti CG da se osamostali. Zato sada Milovi provociraju, masu Petrovickom zastavom, odbijaju da imamo zajednicku himnu i zastavu za Olimpijadu, izbacuju srpske stihove iz njihove nove himne, i osporavaju "Boze pravde" kao "velikosrpsku" himnu. Ukratko, ponovo pokusavaju da Srbiji u medjunarodnoj politici prikace atribute nacionalisticke despotije. U tome nisu sami. Hrvatska i BiH su isto tako razocarane da Toma Nikolic nije pobedio. Pobeda Tadica daje povoljan imidz Srbiji na Zapadu sa kojim Hrvatska i BiH ne mogu da se pomire jer ne mogu da izvuku sve koncesije od Srbije koje zele (ratne ostete, osujete povratak izbeglica i povratak njihove imovine, ukidanje statusa Republici Srpskoj itd.) i za koju trebaju podrsku Zapada. Zato je usldio koncert zvizduka, salvo uvreda po stampi na racun Tadica, otkazivanje drzavnickih poseta, jer je Tadic navodno pokazao neosetljivost i svoje pravo "sovinisticko lice" zato sto se dan njegove inaguracije poklopio sa danom sahrane zrtava pokolja u Srebrenici.

Ma, sve je to jasno...Crnoj Gori fali jedan 5. oktobar, samo sto nema ko da ga izvede.

Ima ko da ga izvede - pro srpski nastrojeni Crnogorci - ali to bi znacilo pocetak gradjanskog rata. Pucisti bi bili optuzeni za velikosrpski nacionalizam a Beograd za podrivanje i ujdurmu protiv vlasti CG. Dalji scenario je vec vidjen.

Dogod Zapad ne odluci da Milu namakne svilen gajtan oko vrata (a nije mi jasno sta ih sprecava da to ucine jer je odavno zasluzio), dotle ce u CG biti Milova vlast i odrzavanje losih odnosa sa Srbijom.

I piss on their new red quasi Albanian lookalike flag. Without doubt the worst people to deal with in the former Yugoslavia.

I say we all move to montenegro! Do it the old fashioned way, MASS MIGRATION!!!

:P

http://www.pobjeda.co.yu/naslovna.phtml?akcija=glasanje

heres what people in Montenegro, Serbia our whoever goes on the site ... what they thought of the new flag, anthem and coat of arms.

Its quite equal .. which makes it even more tough for the people. Theres always mixed numbers when it comes down to them being Serbian or Montenegrin, and etxc.

I have just heard that NOTHING will change for the Olympics. Najgori smo na svetu.

Apparently parliament is rushing to get the new anthem approved before the Olympics. They are sick of the whistling from our own crowd during the anthem.

Ja se iskreno nadam da taj nakaradni hibrid ssastavljen od jedne monarhisticke himne i jedne narodne pesme koja nije himna a kojoj su reci preradjene da se izbaci svaka srpska konotacija, nece postati himna.

Meni licno, i ne samo meni, pesma "Hej, Sloveni!" i po melodiji, i po recima ali najvise po tradiciji odgovara. Tu je pesmu pevao neponovljivi Djacki bataljon, cuvenih 1300 kaplara, kada su 1914. iz Skoplja krenuli na Suvobor kao poslednji zalog Srbije u borbi za slobodu i odbranu casti. Ta se pesma cula 21. oktobra 1941. iz Topovskih supa u Sumaricama kod Kragujevca, iz grla profesora i djaka kragujevacke Muske gimnazije, samo par sati pre odlaska na stratiste. Tada, pa ni kasnije, niko joj nije zvizdao niti lupetao da je "komunisticka". Tek kada je dosao Slobodan Milosevic na vlast, kada su se osnovne ljudske i nacionalne vrednosti okrenule naopako, tek kada su ljudi oprhveni napadima nacionalizma isovinizma poceli da se ponasaju kao neljudi, ova pesma je zgazena i popljuvana.

Pesma ne postaje himan na konkursu, niti politickim dekretom. To se desava u trenutku nacionalnog nadahnuca i uzvisenosti kao sto su bili Suvoborska bitka i streljanje u Kragujevcu.

Šta će biti s himnom? | 16:20 -> 21:47 | Izvor: B92

Beograd -- Još nije izvesno da li će u Skupštini SCG biti usvojen predlog himne državne zajednice.

Sedam dana pred početak olimpijskih igara u Atini - gde je svetu trebalo da bude predstavljena nova himna državne zajednice Srbija i Crna Gora – nije izvesno da li će do tada biti usvojen predlog nove svečane pesme.

O predlogu himne, koji predstavlja mešavinu „Bože pravde“ i „Oj, svijetla majska zoro“, u sredu će se izjasniti poslanici skupštine SCG. Istoga dana, u 16 sati, u olimpijskom selu u Atini biće podignuta zastava SCG, što bi trebalo da bude propraćeno i himnom državne zajednice. Još nije poznato koja će himna tom prilikom biti intonirana, kao ni da li će do tog trenutka parlament SCG konačno doneti odluku o tome šta je zvanična svečana pesma državne zajednice.

Prema ranijim najavama, među poslanicima iz Crne Gore postoji većina za usvajanje ovog predloga, ali su stranke u Srbiji su podeljene. Novu himnu podržavaju DS, DSS, SPO i Nova Srbija, dok su SRS i G17 plus najavili da će glasati protiv.

Kandidat za gradonačelnika Beograda stranke G17 plus Branka Bošnjak najavila je da ta stranka neće glasati za predlog himne, jer se dosledno zalaže za nezavisnu državu Srbiju. "Ovako sačinjena i predložena himna predstavlja novu lakrdiju, s obzirom na to da država koja se sastoji od dve države, koja ima dve valute, država koja ima dva potpuno nezavisna carinska sistema, sada dobija himnu sa dve potpuno različite kompozicije. Himna koja će se svirati u dva tonaliteta, čije su reči izmenjene i praktično falsifikovan deo srpske istorije, nije nešto što će rado pevati ni građani Srbije ni građani Crne Gore", kaže Branka Bošnjak.

O novoj himni, praktično, odlučivaće poslanici SPS-a, koji još nisu doneli definitivnu odluku kako će glasati. Šef poslaničke grupe socijalista Žarko Obradović, međutim, najavio je da stranka najverovatnije neće podržati predlog himne, jer je, kako kaže, taj predlog "neozbiljan". Ukoliko nova himna ne bude usvojena, sportisti SCG u Atini biće pozdravljani starom „Hej Sloveni“, koja je poslednjih godina postala poznata kao himna koju, umesto svečanim stajanjem, na sportskim takmičenjima pozdravljaju burnim zviždanjem. Sa druge strane, nije sigurno ni kako bi među navijačima SCG prošla kompromisna himna, sastavljena iz dve sasvim različite pesme.

What a joke the politicians in this country are! :rolleyes:

They need 3 friggin' years to decide on and change the current anthem and flag? If the montenegrins dont agree, let them have a referendum and see where the people stand on the issue, cause somehow I dont think the problem is with them.

What a pathetic thing to see when Bodiroga had to lift the old flag.

Drulo, that flag and anthem annoy the living shit out of me.

? Who wrote Oj svijetla
? What is the history of the person
? Who did he colaberate with

disgusting

BELGRADE. August 17 (Serbianna). In a ninth extraordinary session of the Serbian Parliament legislators adopted a new coat-of-arms, flag and a national anthem.

Only members of the Socialist Party of Serbia voted against the legislation arguing that the symbols are "monarchist".


Top: Newly adopted coat-of-arms. Bottom: New Serbian tricolor with the reproduced coat-of-arms. (Source: Serbian Parliament)


The new coat-of-arms dates from the 19th century Serbian kingdom and the symbol is reproduced on the newly adopted Serbian flag - a tricolor red, blue and white.

The adopted anthem is the hymn of the Serbian Orthodox Church "Boze pravde" (God of Justice) composed also in the 19th century.

The legislation was adopted under extraordinary sessions clause by agreement of a caucus heads and a petition of 187 legislators demanding urgent hearing and a decision on the symbols of the state. The measure was supported by 183 MPs, and there were no abstentions or votes against the suggestion.

The legislation comes after last week's unsuccessful attempt to adopt new Union symbols for Serbia & Montenegro in time for the Olympics in Athens.

In July, Serbia's union partner, Montenegro, also adopted news state symbols.

More on the session is available on the web at:
http://www.parlament.sr.gov.yu

Now we can start with SiCG!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Are you changing the flag of SiCG or just Serbia?

Are you changing the flag of SiCG or just Serbia?

Just Serbia. Negotiating with Montenegrins is like negotiating with you guys over Prevlaka. IE takes a long long time and in the end we give and the others take.

Maybe I'm nitpicking over this but I think the new flag would have looked better with the grb centered on it instead of left of the mid :googly: I don't quite get it.

:)

Maybe I'm nitpicking over this but I think the new flag would have looked better with the grb centered on it instead of left of the mid :googly: I don't quite get it.

:)

I agree Monte, should be in the centre. This design dates back to the late 1800's. PS Who is the player in your avatar??

Danko Lazovic :)

Kut Lazovic (this time I mean it)

Who made you guys the heraldic experts? :pp

Anyways, it's just the state flag anyway. The national flag is still the plain tricolor.

Who made you guys the heraldic experts? :pp

Anyways, it's just the state flag anyway. The national flag is still the plain tricolor.

Any updates on the SiCG flag Andrija?

Who made you guys the heraldic experts? :pp

Anyways, it's just the state flag anyway. The national flag is still the plain tricolor.

Where did I say anything about the weapon? ;) I only said it would've looked better if it's completely centered, IMO.


Why would the state flag be different from the national flag? Oh well whatever :howler:

Fleka, you're a funny man.

monte, because one flag represents the state (drzavna zastava) and is flown on state buildings and occassions where state officials are present, where the other represents the people (narodna zastava) and can be flown by any Serb anywhere.

Fleka, you're a funny man.

monte, because one flag represents the state (drzavna zastava) and is flown on state buildings and occassions where state officials are present, where the other represents the people (narodna zastava) and can be flown by any Serb anywhere.

I get the difference but not the REASON for it :)

Does France have a state flag and a people's flag? What about the USA? Or Holland, Sweden.. etc? :D

I don't know it just sounds(ed) rather unfamiliar to me ..

BTW since this is a more or less OFF TOPIC thread : Has anyone seen how Holbrooke and Wesley Clarke were laughing and eating with UCK leader Krasniqi, and some of his 'warriors'? They donated 500.000 $ to the democratic party, got to take a pic with John Kerry, and can expect much cooperation from this party if Kerry gets elected. Cooperation in what ? -> AChieving an independent Kosovo.

What has the world come to? The US have acknowledged that the UCK is not far from a terrorist organisation, in fact it's not even allowed to exist any longer, and still Wesley Clarke managed to congratulate these guys, saying how brave they were.

There was a docu on Dutch TV about this, you could see how the UCK leader buys weapons and all sort of army clothing IN THE US (!!!) which he then sends off to Kosovo. It will again be broadcasted next Saturday - 14:40 VPRO.

very sad.

I get the difference but not the REASON for it :)

Does France have a state flag and a people's flag? What about the USA? Or Holland, Sweden.. etc? :D

I don't know it just sounds(ed) rather unfamiliar to me ..

the state flag is for Serbia, not SiCG.... Australia has seperate flags for NSW, Victoria, Queensland, Western Australia etc... all the states, as well as the national states... so im guessing that this is similar?

BTW since this is a more or less OFF TOPIC thread : Has anyone seen how Holbrooke and Wesley Clarke were laughing and eating with UCK leader Krasniqi, and some of his 'warriors'? They donated 500.000 $ to the democratic party, got to take a pic with John Kerry, and can expect much cooperation from this party if Kerry gets elected. Cooperation in what ? -> AChieving an independent Kosovo.

What has the world come to? The US have acknowledged that the UCK is not far from a terrorist organisation, in fact it's not even allowed to exist any longer, and still Wesley Clarke managed to congratulate these guys, saying how brave they were.

There was a docu on Dutch TV about this, you could see how the UCK leader buys weapons and all sort of army clothing IN THE US (!!!) which he then sends off to Kosovo. It will again be broadcasted next Saturday - 14:40 VPRO.

very sad.


If Kerry gets elected the US is going back into the balkans.

:yuck: :wallbang:

Of course in reaction to your post Monte. I missed it but I'll be sure to try and watch next Saturday. Although at the end, no doubt all I'll feel is anger.

I didnt want Bush to win, but this is simply too much. Is there not a single person in that godforsaken country with some dignity and selfrespect?!

Yeh, I read it in Blic that Kerry told them that Kosovo will be 'sorted' if he is elected.

Oh and Drulo, your avatar just reminded me. When I went to buy tickets for the Young Boys game and then were heading towards the club shop, who was I to see but Mr Zigic himself. He looks a lot taller than 202cm they say he is, I myself have 185 and he completely towered over me. He went and chose himself his boots. While when I went to buy a the top for my sister, 7 or 8 players were training. Markovic and Popov were among them with Ivan Dudic, Bogavac, and a few that I didn't recognise. While watching, Popov completely mishit the ball when trying to control it, it was quite funny.

Does France have a state flag and a people's flag? What about the USA? Or Holland, Sweden.. etc?

France I'm not sure but...Austria does. You know there is the Austrian flag with just the stripes, that's the national flag, and then there is the version with the eagle, that's the state flag. Spain, also, there is the plain colours only version (national flag) and the one with the coat of arms (state flag), then there is also the plain Russian flag, and the one with the eagle which you see behind Mr. Putin in the Kremlin when he's making a speech on CNN :D, and there is also a similiar example with...San Marino. ;) So you see it's not something we came up with, and no, don't ask me how I know so much about flags. :pp

Btw, about Kerry-Bush, well you see Kerry will most likely be like Clinton (spells a disaster for us, we would've also been screwed had Gore won), on the other hand Bush will be content with bombing Teheran, Damascus or whichever comes next in the "war against terror" which we are thankfully not a target in. Bush is better.

hehe, Andrija's a flag nerd. :D




j/k man

Kako to da se forumski helenofili ;) pitaju za drzavne, narodne isl. zastave? Na primer Grcka zvanicna zastava je plava sa belim krstom preko celog plavog polja. S druge strane, Grcka uglavnom koristi svoju pomorsku zastavu (krst i plavo-bele pruge). To je kao kada bi Srbija koristila, recimo, zastavu zandarmerije ili SPC.

Sto se tice Busa i Kerija, prvi je bolji za Srbiju na kratke staze ali na duge staze ne valja. Ono sto je dobro je to sto Republikanci svoju spoljnopoliticku doktrinu jos uvek baziraju na Kisindzerovoj doktrini u kojoj se Srbija dobro kotira. Demokrate, s druge strane, baziraju svoju politiku na doktrini Bzezinskog u kojoj Srbija zauzima lose mesto. Problem sa Republikancima sto je predsednik idiot i sto drzavu vodi hunta (Cejni, Ramsfeld, Volfovic. itd.) koja je opasna po svetsku stabilnost. Oni mogu da podrzavaju Srbiju, ali isto tako mogu da svet gurnu u jos vecu krizu u kojoj ce Srbija kao siromasna, nestabilna i nerazvijena zemlja da strada medju prvima. Prema tome, najbolje je ostati neopredeljen u dolazecim izborima u SAD i cekati 2008. kada ce najverovatnije g-dja Klinton da bude izabrana za Pretsednicu SAD i zauzimati poziciju koja ce u to vreme biti povoljna po Srbiju. (Naravno, to prvenstveno zavisi od mudrosti, ili tacnije, pomanjkanja gluposti srpskih politicara i dela njihovih glasaca, pogotovo onih kojima nacionalisticka i populisticka politika leze na srcu.)

I'll never get rid of that image probably :D :embarass:

Anyway, I asked because I don't quite understand the situation. Some countries apparently have a separate state flag, while others don't.

Russia's example had also come to my mind Andrija, silly that I forgot about San Marino :D

Drulo yeah it really is sh*tty to watch but hey it's reality ;( and that makes it worthwhile the watch.

Ma ne sekiraj se Monte, taj ti imidz dobro stoji.;)

The situation down there none understands. The new "grb" has even 2 crowns. Unbelievable. It better fits with those Tudjman's gardists in front of Banski Dvori, dressed as Hungarian gipsy "jambasi", then to a modern republic that Serbia aspires to become.

Nisam znao da vas heraldicara ima toliko po forumima ovde...

Nema sta da se ne razume, to je grb Kraljevine Srbije iz XIX veka (mozda Srbija i ne zeli da postane moderna republika, vec moderna kraljevina:D). Krune su heraldicke tj. simbolizuju suverenitet u ovom slucaju (grb kraljevine od 1903. je imao krunu Karadjordjevica). Slicne konstrukcije mozemo naci npr. na grbovima Belgije i Svedske, a cak i grb Kanade ima dve krune ;) tako da je vredjanje srpskog znamenja poredjenjem sa Tudjmanovim gardistima zaista neprimereno i ovom slucaju, krajnje neukusno. Licno medjutim smatram da je trebalo izostaviti plast, ne zbog 2 krune, nego zato sto izgleda previse staromodno i glomazno, ali zato postoji i mali grb i veliki grb pa sta se kome svidi. :)

you already SAID THAT Andrija, so now you know, you have allllllll the expertise you could ever wish for, right here on this forum :)

wtf would you mention Belgium and their royal symbols, everybody laughs at their royal family :D Sweden, ok.. they have Victoria.

OK, so I'm not an expert on royal families...sheesh...I can't know everything :rollani: :pp :D

Ja ne vredjam srpska znamenja nego pokusavam branim Srbiju od kica i neukusa. Koje bre crne krune, krinovi i porfirni plastovi oblozeni hermelinom u jednoj napacenoj, seljackoj polupisnemoj zemlji ciji je stub drzave bio pandur sa batinom i cija se cela istorija moze da svede u dve reci: JAO NAMA.

Sta kazes moderna kraljevina? Ha, ha, ha, ha.... Ko bi mogao da bude drug kralj te moderne kraljevine?

Pa Bence posto si ti tako svestran eto predlazem tebe. Jel moze? Posto ne volis krune, napravicemo ti jedan venac od listova sljive...

Ti bas ne mozes bez kica?;)

Ma jeeeeeeeste...

The previously mentioned documentary can be watched online as well. It's mostly in English. http://www.vpro.nl/programma/tegenlicht/afleveringen/18793157/
Choose: Video --> Bekijk de uitzending --> choose windows or real on the right.

I dont understand dutch

It"s Mostly In English





you witty a$$

It"s Mostly In English





you witty a$$

What makes you think i can understand english?

Priceless :D

If you dont understand English either then there's still a fair part spoken in Albanian so that should do the trick for you ;)

Actually this was the only subject I considered too serious to be turned into a joke but hey I guess it's just me.

If you dont understand English either then there's still a fair part spoken in Albanian so that should do the trick for you ;)

Actually this was the only subject I considered too serious to be turned into a joke but hey I guess it's just me.

Probably just you. ;)

Althugh calling me witty ass was just asking for it.

Yeah... so you interpreted it, I was actually asking for some spanking :tongue:

Yeah... so you interpreted it, I was actually asking for some spanking :tongue:

Is your boyfriend not satisfying your needs? ;)

Is yours?

Ha, ha, ha,......

Is yours?

I knew that was coming ;)

This is beginning to be like a chat line. Soon you'll be asking for Monte's photo.

I think he might already have that.

Hence the chatting. ;)

Monte = f*cking Hot

:D